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View Full Version : Pedroia HAS to start. PERIOD



corngordon
11-20-2006, 10:56 AM
Dustin is a key to the future of the club. Bring in a good SS. Being strong up the middle is so important. If he were on any number of clubs (Twins, A's, Blue Jays), there would be no talk of anyone else at that position.

Ron Gordon
Corn, Gordon and Flanagan on the Red Sox (podcast)

BSN07
11-20-2006, 12:12 PM
He will start. The other options available have just as many ? as Pedroia. So they will spend money eleswhere other then on a 2B, because they have a cheap and talented one in house.

Texas_Red_Sox_Fan
11-20-2006, 12:54 PM
get Michael Young and hopefully Pedroia can produce from the 9 spot in the lineup

ksushi
11-20-2006, 01:36 PM
I highly doubt the sox get michael young. I hope Pedroia does win the 2B job though

Coco's Disciples
11-20-2006, 03:18 PM
I disagree he is the key to the future but I would like to see him at 2B and batting 9th very much.

Ray10
11-21-2006, 02:09 AM
Pedroia is more than likely going to be the Sox full time second baseman come next season. I like him in the lineup I think he is a great player. He just needs a bit more time to mature and bring up his game but I think starting will help him out alot and we will see him become a great second baseman for the Sox. By the way does anyone know where George Kottaras and Josh Papelbon will be starting the year come the 2007 season.

jsinger121
11-21-2006, 08:11 AM
Kottaras will be in Pawtucket, Josh Papelbon will be in Greenville.

AZBlue
11-21-2006, 10:54 AM
Dustin is a key to the future of the club. Bring in a good SS. Being strong up the middle is so important. If he were on any number of clubs (Twins, A's, Blue Jays), there would be no talk of anyone else at that position.


Have you seen Pedroia play? He is an average to below average second baseman. A cheap, average player can be important for financial reasons, but "key to the future of the club"?!

MC Hammer
11-21-2006, 12:55 PM
Have you seen Pedroia play? He is an average to below average second baseman. A cheap, average player can be important for financial reasons, but "key to the future of the club"?!
He's above average defensively IMO, but his offense leaves a lot to be desired. I don't see how you can say you "have to start" a guy who couldn't hit a beachball last year.

If he's the best they can do he'll start, but I know I'd be trying to upgrade that position. If the Sox weren't willing to start Hanley last year then why in gods name would they start Dustin this year?

Mr Crunchy
11-21-2006, 02:22 PM
maybe i missed much of last year but didnt our 2b make the allstar team??

why were we in such a hurry to move an allstar in favor of a guy who may turn out to be another......mark loretta
if he makes it
if he hits .195 into june then there will be some issues

CrespoBlows
11-21-2006, 04:22 PM
maybe i missed much of last year but didnt our 2b make the allstar team??

why were we in such a hurry to move an allstar in favor of a guy who may turn out to be another......mark loretta
if he makes it
if he hits .195 into june then there will be some issues


why does anyone care about these popularity contests anyways?

Who cares if Mark Loretta made the all-star team? He only made it because he happened to play for the Red Sox.

Maybe Loretta might represent a small upgrade over Pedoria, but I'd rather spend Loretta's $4-5 million on a reliever.

a700hitter
11-21-2006, 08:54 PM
Who cares if Mark Loretta made the all-star team? He only made it because he happened to play for the Red Sox.

Maybe Loretta might represent a small upgrade over Pedoria, but I'd rather spend Loretta's $4-5 million on a reliever..284 is not a slight upgrade over .191.

Coco's Disciples
11-21-2006, 09:36 PM
Well yeah considering Pedroia is bound to hit sub .200 the rest of his days, overpay for Loretta and let the kid rot.

a700hitter
11-21-2006, 09:52 PM
Well yeah considering Pedroia is bound to hit sub .200 the rest of his days, overpay for Loretta and let the kid rot.Maybe he is only going to be a .250 hitter. In which case, he should rot on the bench.

Mr Crunchy
11-21-2006, 09:59 PM
offense sucked last year in the dog days
pedroia didnt help at all
im willing to give him the chance and i didnt know lorettas getting that kind of coin
for 4M we can get 1/2 a matt clement!!

kidding
but that is a big price for loretta

it seems to me that agon and loretta had a nice thing going defensivly
i hate to see that go....on the future

HeadOfSoxNation
11-22-2006, 12:03 AM
SOMEONE JUST PLEAAAAAASE FREAKING TELL ME WHAT THIS GUY'S DONE TO PROVE THAT HE CAN PERFORM IN THE MAJOR LEAGUES?!? NOTHING! NOT A SINGLE FREAKING THING!! I KNOW HE'S TORN UP THE MINORS, BUT HE WAS GIVEN A CHANCE LAST YEAR TO PLAY A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF TIME IN THE BIGS AND HE WAS BELOW AVERAGE AT BEST!!! COMMON PEOPLE...HE HASSSSS TO START?!?!?!?

Phew...had to vent there for a second...

Watching Pedroia play last year was, to me, like getting all pumped up to go to your first strip club, going in, and seeing girls dancing around in parkas and leg warmers. I was so freaking excited and then he did NOTHING. He couldn't have even hit Matt FREAKING Clement if he was given the chance, and I could hit that bum. He's gotta prove himself in the spring before anyone gives this guy ANY kind of a starting job...or a job in the bigs at all for that matter.

a700hitter
11-22-2006, 12:23 AM
I think it would be a mistake to give him the job on the first day of spring training.

jsinger121
11-22-2006, 12:29 AM
Here is a quote from Mark Loretta that was in the Boston Globe


"They haven't made an offer," he said. "Everything we've heard is that they're going with [Dustin Pedroia], that they don't want to retard his development."

Fried Neckbones
11-22-2006, 12:39 AM
I think it would be a mistake to give him the job on the first day of spring training.

Honestly, though, who is going to compete with him for the job? Cora? It would not be smart to bring in a free agent or trade for a 2b just to compete with Pedrioa - not to mention that it would completely shatter his confidence. There really isn't anybody else in their system who would deserve an invite to spring training. He's 23, plays good d, and will adjust to MLB pitching. He may not end up being a super-star, but he will be a solid middle infielder.

Also, he'll be cheap, freeing up more $$$ for Lugo, Drew, Matsuzaka, and whoever else in on the FO radar.

MC Hammer
11-22-2006, 12:48 AM
Honestly, though, who is going to compete with him for the job? Cora? It would not be smart to bring in a free agent or trade for a 2b just to compete with Pedrioa - not to mention that it would completely shatter his confidence. There really isn't anybody else in their system who would deserve an invite to spring training. He's 23, plays good d, and will adjust to MLB pitching. He may not end up being a super-star, but he will be a solid middle infielder.

Also, he'll be cheap, freeing up more $$$ for Lugo, Drew, Matsuzaka, and whoever else in on the FO radar.

I love how money never matters until you guys want a prospect to play. Hey we can pay 51 million for a cup of coffee with some kid ... but lets not go crazy and spend 4 million a year on a 2B. Lets try and be consistant here.

jsinger121
11-22-2006, 12:54 AM
The last time I checked Bill James still works for the Red Sox and is a pretty big voice in the Sox FO. He gave a very solid 2007 projection for Pedroia that I'm sure the FO will likely go with in their assessment. His projection for him were numbers that had ROY potential. Loretta is good as gone.

Fried Neckbones
11-22-2006, 12:59 AM
I love how money never matters until you guys want a prospect to play. Hey we can pay 51 million for a cup of coffee with some kid ... but lets not go crazy and spend 4 million a year on a 2B. Lets try and be consistant here.

I'm not saying that the Sox front office does not spend money, nor that they should NOT spend money on players. I'm saying that they should not spend ridiculous amounts of money on every player at every position. If saving $3.5 million on a 2b means getting Drew, I'm all for that.

BSN07
11-22-2006, 06:28 AM
Give the kid a chance. He hit .191 in what like 30 at bats? Lets get a little larger number of AB before we say he will never hit a ball. Manny always starts out with a shitty BA in the beginning of every season, then he catches fire and bats .300 every year. Im not saying Pedroia is Manny by any stretch of the imagination but Pedroia is expected to be a .270ish hitter. Which I think would be decent for a nine hole hitter. This is why its called a BA avg. Maybe we just got the low end of it. Maybe his bat will be better next time around.

MC Hammer
11-22-2006, 01:06 PM
I'm not saying that the Sox front office does not spend money, nor that they should NOT spend money on players. I'm saying that they should not spend ridiculous amounts of money on every player at every position. If saving $3.5 million on a 2b means getting Drew, I'm all for that.
Eventhough you could use the same logic ... and just start WMP instead of signing Drew ... and then use that money elsewhere?

On a side note ... if both start this year WMP's number will blow JD Drew's away.

edge4414
11-22-2006, 02:05 PM
SOMEONE JUST PLEAAAAAASE FREAKING TELL ME WHAT THIS GUY'S DONE TO PROVE THAT HE CAN PERFORM IN THE MAJOR LEAGUES?!? NOTHING! NOT A SINGLE FREAKING THING!! I KNOW HE'S TORN UP THE MINORS, BUT HE WAS GIVEN A CHANCE LAST YEAR TO PLAY A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF TIME IN THE BIGS AND HE WAS BELOW AVERAGE AT BEST!!! COMMON PEOPLE...HE HASSSSS TO START?!?!?!?

Phew...had to vent there for a second...

Watching Pedroia play last year was, to me, like getting all pumped up to go to your first strip club, going in, and seeing girls dancing around in parkas and leg warmers. I was so freaking excited and then he did NOTHING. He couldn't have even hit Matt FREAKING Clement if he was given the chance, and I could hit that bum. He's gotta prove himself in the spring before anyone gives this guy ANY kind of a starting job...or a job in the bigs at all for that matter.

Going with this logic Markakis would have been sent to the minors at mid-season or before and H Kendrick wouldn't be the Angels 2b. Both failed miserably in their early opportunity but look pretty good now.

BSN07
11-22-2006, 02:09 PM
Ya lets just trade him so we can bitch when he breaks out like hanley and sanchez.

redsoxrules
11-22-2006, 02:22 PM
Eventhough you could use the same logic ... and just start WMP instead of signing Drew ... and then use that money elsewhere?

On a side note ... if both start this year WMP's number will blow JD Drew's away.

:lol: if anything WMP is gonna blow past strike 3, 200 times

Mr Crunchy
11-22-2006, 03:42 PM
pat listach was a rookie of the year 2nd basemen 15 years ago
anyone remember him??
he of the 5 career homeruns and 143 career rbi??
didnt think so

anyone remember the last time we had an allstar 2nd basemen outside loretta??
i go back to mike andrews,doug griffin,denny doyle,marty barrett,jody reed,luis alicea etc...
i dont remember any of them making the allstar team although barrett had an awesome 86 world series

loretta turns the dp hits .300 and is limited in range...someone said 4-5M per?
we'd been paying 2nd basemen the league minimum for 20 years till loretta came and then blam
we got an allstar

pedroia??
maybe hes ROY material just like pat listash was
hopefully he ends up more like loretta though

Bosoxwest
11-22-2006, 06:08 PM
This is ridiculous.

At age 24 in AAA Mark Loretta was a tweener MIF who put up an OPS of .737 after putting up .767 in AA at age 23.
At age 23 in AAA Dustin Pedroia was a tweener MIF who put up an OPS of .810, after putting up an OPS of .917 in Portland at age 22.

At age 35 Loretta had an OPS of .706, and 23-year old Pedroia only put up a .561 OPS. They both sucked. However, their peripherals were pretty well matched:

BB rate: Loretta 7 % / Pedroia 7% (although historically Pedroia's IsoD is far superior)
K rate: Loretta 9% / Pedroia 7% (Pedroia = lowest on team)
LD%: Loretta 27.1% / Pedroia 22.5% (both good, Loretta exceptional)
IsoP: Loretta .076 / Pedroia .112 (Pedroia showed more power)
BABIP: Loretta .310 / Pedroia .181 (Pedroia under Cub-esque curse at the plate)

DEF:
RF: Loretta 4.88 / Pedroia 6.19
ZR: Loretta .805 / Pedroia .857

These guys are basically the same mental and physical make-up: the difference is Pedroia is more athletic, and freaking 12 years younger, and $2.6M cheaper. He will start at 2B next year, as he should.

AZBlue
11-23-2006, 09:48 PM
Ya lets just trade him so we can bitch when he breaks out like hanley and sanchez.

Every scout who has watched both Hanley Ramirez and Dustin Pedroia play would laugh at that comparison.

a700hitter
11-23-2006, 11:04 PM
Every scout who has watched both Hanley Ramirez and Dustin Pedroia play would laugh at that comparison.Hanley was a 5 tool prospect. I don't see any major tools from Pedroia. He has average speed, an average arm and below average power. He's a midget with a big swing. That just can't work out well, unless he really alters his swing.

BSN07
11-24-2006, 09:48 AM
Yes and what was freddie Sanchez when we sent him packing? I'm just saying, we let a guy come up for 80 or so AB's, he doesn't do well so we want him replaced, then when we ship him off and he does well for another team everyone complains.

BSN07
11-24-2006, 09:49 AM
If I remember correctly, Hanley hit like shit when he came up for the Sox too.

jsinger121
11-24-2006, 10:56 AM
If I remember correctly, Hanley hit like shit when he came up for the Sox too.

He had 2 at-bats and I don't think anyone should even compare the two. They are two different types of players.

a700hitter
11-24-2006, 11:17 AM
Yes and what was freddie Sanchez when we sent him packing? I'm just saying, we let a guy come up for 80 or so AB's, he doesn't do well so we want him replaced, then when we ship him off and he does well for another team everyone complains.Freddie Sanchez could not hold down a starting position for the Pirates until he was 27 years old. It's pure foolishness to hand Pedroia the starting second base job at age 22. He simply doesn't have any plus skills to overcome his inexperience and the bumps that he will hit in the major leagues. He needs to cut his teeth more slowly in the majors.

BSN07
11-24-2006, 12:07 PM
Yes, but the millions you would have to pay to bring a "fill in" could be used elseswhere. Besides maybe Lorretta, Belliard and maybe Durham. Lorretta and Durham are old and iffy health wise.Belliard could be an option, but then Pedroia is stuck in the minors.

SCM33
11-24-2006, 08:36 PM
Pedroia HAS to start. PERIOD

No he doesnt.

rician blast
11-29-2006, 10:22 AM
No he doesnt.

amen, SCM.

rician blast
11-29-2006, 10:24 AM
Hanley was a 5 tool prospect. I don't see any major tools from Pedroia. He has average speed, an average arm and below average power. He's a midget with a big swing. That just can't work out well, unless he really alters his swing.

He's David Eckstein at best but reminds me a little too much of Lou Merloni.

hey, let's see what happens with him. one thing for sure...he won't be confused with Cano.

SuperManny
11-29-2006, 12:40 PM
He's David Eckstein at best but reminds me a little too much of Lou Merloni.

hey, let's see what happens with him. one thing for sure...he won't be confused with Cano.

You mean because he can play defense? :D jk. Pedroia isn't the hitter than Cano is but he's a better overall 2B IMO because of his defense. He struggled last year but hes a good player and will be fine given time. He's not good enough for SS IMO but at 2B he should be fine.

Beckett95
11-29-2006, 06:24 PM
Interesting comment from Theo today in his press conference


When queried about re-signing infielder Alex Cora, Epstein said, “Cora is great protection [at shortstop]. [Dustin] Pedroia came up as shortstop. Beyond that, we have shortstop prospects that are not major league ready, but are coming up in the minors.”

Anyone think that Pedroia may play SS this year

ANiMAL
11-29-2006, 06:31 PM
i hope they give him a shot at playing this year. I hope he does well, if not ,than its back to the drawing board.... but yet it could be too late

BSN07
11-30-2006, 07:45 AM
He´s either gonna start, or be part of some trade.

TedWilliams101
12-03-2006, 02:18 PM
No way Pedroia should play at SS. I don't even like the idea of him playing in the majors next year. If the sox must though, I would much rather at 2B. I think his defense is a bit over-hyped. He has an average glove, slightly above average speed, but his arm strength is below-average and has very limited range. That doesn't spell good for a SS. A SS needs great range and a strong arm.

I would like to see him play 2B and Lugo at SS. Then next year go out and get Hanley Ramirez back. His contract is up after the 2007 season. He grew up in our farm system and he should return and play for the bosox. I say go get him and pay him how ever much he is charging. He would be the perfect lead-off hitter. We need Defense, speed, and a spark bat. What better than youth like him.

The obvious issue would be that the Marlins offer him a good contract next offseason. I believe though, if we show enough interest in him and would be willing to give him the best contract, he could end up with us. I just hate to see him on the Marlins.

riverside sluggers
12-03-2006, 02:22 PM
His contract is up after 2007?

You do know that the Marlins have control of him for the next 5 years, right?

Concerning Pedroia, the Sox believe that leaving him in Triple A would be bad for his natural progress. He's going to be a valuable member of the '07 team

Papelbon58
12-03-2006, 02:23 PM
No way Pedroia should play at SS. I don't even like the idea of him playing in the majors next year. If the sox must though, I would much rather at 2B. I think his defense is a bit over-hyped. He has an average glove, slightly above average speed, but his arm strength is below-average and has very limited range. That doesn't spell good for a SS. A SS needs great range and a strong arm.

I would like to see him play 2B and Lugo at SS. Then next year go out and get Hanley Ramirez back. His contract is up after the 2007 season. He grew up in our farm system and he should return and play for the bosox. I say go get him and pay him how ever much he is charging. He would be the perfect lead-off hitter. We need Defense, speed, and a spark bat. What better than youth like him.

The obvious issue would be that the Marlins offer him a good contract next offseason. I believe though, if we show enough interest in him and would be willing to give him the best contract, he could end up with us. I just hate to see him on the Marlins.

his contract does not end until he has 6 years of major league service time

TedWilliams101
12-03-2006, 02:36 PM
Shit, ya I just noticed that. I'm really starting to hate the Beckett trade. Marlins wanna take that back? lol...

a700hitter
12-03-2006, 04:36 PM
No way Pedroia should play at SS. I don't even like the idea of him playing in the majors next year. If the sox must though, I would much rather at 2B. I think his defense is a bit over-hyped. He has an average glove, slightly above average speed, but his arm strength is below-average and has very limited range. That doesn't spell good for a SS. His speed is only average. Maybe part of the Dodger package for Manny will be Furcal to play SS and the Sox can sign Lugo to play second.

rician blast
12-05-2006, 02:59 PM
Pedroia has to start his period?

did I read that right?

I guess he's "bush"-league, then, huh?

Peters34
12-05-2006, 09:00 PM
I think we need to sign loretta
he was amazining

Coco's Disciples
12-05-2006, 09:19 PM
Ugh.

NO!!!

TheKilo
12-05-2006, 10:36 PM
I think we need to sign loretta
he was amazining

The Reds offered him a 2-year deal.