Yankees might pull out of Santana chase...(for now) - Talksox

jacksonianmarch · 12-03-2007, 11:49 PM

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/s...e=MLBHeadlines

They are asking for Hughes, Kennedy and Melky.

Hughes is still considered a future ace and right now is at least a #3 pitcher. Kennedy right now is at least a back end pitcher with #3 potential. Melky is one of the better armed CFers in the game and has solid offensive AVG potential.

That's 3 guys who are already in the majors, one with a very high potential and two with solid potentials who are more realistic to reach them. WAY too much, even for the best pitcher in baseball. If the sox get Johan for Ellsbury and 2 minor leaguers, I will shit myself. The fact that the Twins are turning down 3 solid 23 and under Major Leaguers makes me feel as if they dont have much interest in dealing him unless they are blown away. We'll see if they change their tune when their backs go against the wall. Unless the sox include Buchholz, I dont see how they get him. But they have pulled off the surprise before.

example1 · 12-04-2007, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacksonianmarch

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/s...e=MLBHeadlines

They are asking for Hughes, Kennedy and Melky.

Hughes is still considered a future ace and right now is at least a #3 pitcher. Kennedy right now is at least a back end pitcher with #3 potential. Melky is one of the better armed CFers in the game and has solid offensive AVG potential.

That's 3 guys who are already in the majors, one with a very high potential and two with solid potentials who are more realistic to reach them. WAY too much, even for the best pitcher in baseball. If the sox get Johan for Ellsbury and 2 minor leaguers, I will shit myself. The fact that the Twins are turning down 3 solid 23 and under Major Leaguers makes me feel as if they dont have much interest in dealing him unless they are blown away. We'll see if they change their tune when their backs go against the wall. Unless the sox include Buchholz, I dont see how they get him. But they have pulled off the surprise before.

If neither team gets him, the Red Sox will have won.

TheKilo · 12-04-2007, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by example1

If neither team gets him, the Red Sox will have won.

Hey I agree with you. First time in weeks.

jacksonianmarch · 12-04-2007, 07:19 AM

The sox will have won for 2008. If he goes to Free Agency, we win big time.

He Hate Me · 12-04-2007, 09:23 AM

Man I am so done with this. It is seriously time to just move on.

26 to 6 · 12-04-2007, 11:26 AM

As great as it would be having Santana in pinstripes, i've struggled with the fact that to get him we'd be giving up some of our solid young guys, who I think many Yankee fans have grown to love. So although as it looks now we wont be getting Santana, we still have Hughes and Melky, which isn't exactly a bad thing.

jacksonianmarch · 12-04-2007, 01:26 PM

Status quo is not a bad thing IMO. Hughes and Joba are gonna be filthy for a long time. Wang at 27 would slot in as a very goo #3 and Kennedy has a long future in the game as well. In a yr or two, we will have one of the best young rotations in the game.

das11209 · 12-04-2007, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacksonianmarch

Status quo is not a bad thing IMO. Hughes and Joba are gonna be filthy for a long time. Wang at 27 would slot in as a very goo #3 and Kennedy has a long future in the game as well. In a yr or two, we will have one of the best young rotations in the game.

You are amazing in spinning any situation in favor of a particular direction. Ever considered politics instead of medicine?

He Hate Me · 12-04-2007, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by das11209

You are amazing in spinning any situation in favor of a particular direction. Ever considered politics instead of medicine?

a rotation of Petite-Wang-Joba-Hughes-Kennedy/Mussina will do just fine actually. We want Santana but the price is just too high.

das11209 · 12-04-2007, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by He Hate Me

a rotation of Petite-Wang-Joba-Hughes-Kennedy/Mussina will do just fine actually. We want Santana but the price is just too high.

If you say so. Hughes just had one good second half. We all know how Wang can fall apart. Joba has never been a starter in the major. I am sure Mussina will win 20 games for you. The only player I think is close to a # 1 is Petitte - and he is getting old too.

But - if you guys are happy with that - I am happy for you. Might turn out better than Carla and Igawa in your rotation on opening day.

jacksonianmarch · 12-04-2007, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by das11209

You are amazing in spinning any situation in favor of a particular direction. Ever considered politics instead of medicine?

the rotation still is better than any we have come into the season with the past few seasons. Think about it.

RJ- bust
Pavana- bust
Wright- bust
Vazquez- bust
Brown- bust

Last yr we started the season with a rotation of Wang, Pettitte, Mussina, Pavano, Rasner all the while knowing that Clemens was in the wings. Aside from Wang and Pettitte the rest failed. Well, Wang and Pettitte are back. And instead of relying on old guys or fringe players, we are relying on 3 hot prospects at the back end of the rotation. We know what we will get out of Wang and Pettitte (for the most part). If only one of the kids actually pitches well, then we have a top 3 of our rotation that is nice. If all 3 make strides this season, obviously not CY type strides, then our rotation will be solid. And instead of having to rely on moose every 5th day, we get to use him as a spot starter, ie his arm will be fresher. And when he had time off, he was good in return. If you guys get Santana, your rotation will be far and away the best in the game. But it doesnt mean ours will suck.

jacksonianmarch · 12-04-2007, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by das11209

If you say so. Hughes just had one good second half. We all know how Wang can fall apart. Joba has never been a starter in the major. I am sure Mussina will win 20 games for you. The only player I think is close to a # 1 is Petitte - and he is getting old too.

But - if you guys are happy with that - I am happy for you. Might turn out better than Carla and Igawa in your rotation on opening day.

Hughes had one good second half? Hughes was hurt for the first half and totally sucked for a stretch of 3-4 starts. Once the pitching coach from AAA came up and unmonkeyed around with his mechanics (thanks Gator) he started pitching well again. Well, that pitching coach is now the MLB pitching coach, so that excuse has flown. That being said, I expect Hughes to be very good this season. Chamberlain hasnt started, that is true, but in the minors he wasnt just dominant, he was dirty. And we saw what he could do to MLB hitters in the clutch. It wasnt even fair. As a starter, he likely wont be throwing 101, but he can sit in the high 90s for 5-6 innings like he did in Tampa and Trenton. And in terms of Kennedy, you dont rocket through a system having the success that he had and winning the MiLB pitcher of the yr if you suck. He is a good pitcher too. All three of these guys have high upside. It all depends on how they adjust. But to imply that they will flop is more wishful thinking than anything.

And in terms of Wang, um, aside from last yrs playoffs, where else did he flop? Yeah, he didnt. He is about as good a bet to win 15-20 games as anyone with the offense returning. Face it, with Wang and Pettitte atop the rotation, we have 2 guys who will likely give us 400IP and 35-40 wins.

26 to 6 · 12-04-2007, 01:57 PM

In addittion to those guys, for insurance we still have guys like Rasner coming back from injury, Chase Wright who didnt do too poorly in his stint last year, Igawa; who despite his performance last year and the doubts Yankee/basebll fans have about him CAN/WILL be a solid pitcher in the Major leagues. He's too good not to be.

....can't wait for the responses on that one

Basically what I'm saying is that while we may not have Johan Santana or Josh Beckett or Jake Peavy or Ben Sheets, we do still have a formidable rotation with hot young studs, and decent insurance policies. Humberto Sanchez will be healthy, and although the Yankees plan on converting him to the bullpen he has experience starting so he could be another insurance option too. All I'm saying is that when you have a guy like Mike Mussina, with his savvy at the back end or as your spot starter, can't be too bad.

das11209 · 12-04-2007, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 26 to 6

In addittion to those guys, for insurance we still have guys like Rasner coming back from injury, Chase Wright who didnt do too poorly in his stint last year, Igawa; who despite his performance last year and the doubts Yankee/basebll fans have about him CAN/WILL be a solid pitcher in the Major leagues. He's too good not to be.

....can't wait for the responses on that one

All I can say is my car and home insurance looks better than your insurance policy. Hopefully we see your insurance more often on the field.

He Hate Me · 12-04-2007, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by das11209

If you say so. Hughes just had one good second half. We all know how Wang can fall apart. Joba has never been a starter in the major. I am sure Mussina will win 20 games for you. The only player I think is close to a # 1 is Petitte - and he is getting old too.

But - if you guys are happy with that - I am happy for you. Might turn out better than Carla and Igawa in your rotation on opening day.

and we could just say as many bad things about your team if we wanted to spin it that way. I could go on about the mediocore performance by your pitching staff against us this year, etc. but I'm really not interested in getting into a pissing match over that. I'm fine with our rotation, I'd prefer to have Santana, but we had the best record in baseball last year after June something, and if not for the game 2 gnats, we probably would have beenn favorites against the Sox in the ALCS considering how we played gaainst you guys during the regular season, so our pitching staff will probably do just fine.