Padres cut Jim Edmonds loose - Talksox

CrespoBlows · 05-09-2008, 04:47 PM

The Red Sox may have found a match for Coco Crisp.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8...0813162&ATT=49

BoSox21 · 05-09-2008, 04:49 PM

I guess that's the end of the line for Edmonds

Jayhawk Bill · 05-09-2008, 05:19 PM

I continue to support Julio Lugo and Coco Crisp for Khalil Greene; the Padres might be receptive to that right now.

Crisp: .315/.338/.384
Lugo: .286/.351/.345

Greene: .209/.264/.295

The Red Sox have Drew, Manny, Jacoby left in the outfield, plus Moss when he's back in a month or so. If Greene doesn't return to his power-hitting self, there's Lowrie, whose best position is shortstop, and Cora is ready to return.

If Greene can't hit, and if 2007 was a pure fluke, at least the Red Sox are rid of Lugo's contract and two players more unpopular than they deserve to be in Boston.

If Greene returns to 2007 form, and if both Park Factors and the AL-NL difference are considered, Boston has another Rico Petrocelli in his prime.

Sweet Chin Music33 · 05-09-2008, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayhawk Bill

I continue to support Julio Lugo and Coco Crisp for Khalil Greene; the Padres might be receptive to that right now.

Crisp: .315/.338/.384
Lugo: .286/.351/.345

Greene: .209/.264/.295

The Red Sox have Drew, Manny, Jacoby left in the outfield, plus Moss when he's back in a month or so. If Greene doesn't return to his power-hitting self, there's Lowrie, whose best position is shortstop, and Cora is ready to return.

If Greene can't hit, and if 2007 was a pure fluke, at least the Red Sox are rid of Lugo's contract and two players more unpopular than they deserve to be in Boston.

If Greene returns to 2007 form, and if both Park Factors and the AL-NL difference are considered, Boston has another Rico Petrocelli in his prime.

You and I had a discussion about this before. I really really really dont want Greene.

As much as I trash Lugo for his shortcomings, hes a better offensive player than Greene. He gets on base more, actually....Greene is completely against the FO offensive philosophy. Last years HR outburst is looking like a complete fluke, and hes hit only 1 this year so far. Lugo runs circles around Greene on the bases.

He is a defensive upgrade.

Lugo and Crisp should bring in way more value than Greene, despite their salaries.

As good as Lowrie has looked, he may not be at SS in the future. I think he may end up at 3B. So if they acquired Greene, it doesnt make sense bc he will not be their long term option, and there is a chance that Lowrie may not be either. At least Lugo gives a little stability (as bad as it is) for the next few years.

I think that if Lugo starts to slip offensively, and continues to boot balls.....Cora may be seeing a lot of time at SS until they find someone else, other than Greene.

EDIT: To stay on topic, feel for the guy....class act and I really enjoyed watching him play.

CrespoBlows · 05-09-2008, 06:28 PM

Greene's numbers are dragged down substantially by playing 50% of his game at PETCO Park.

Home (OPS) - .653
Away (OPS) - .830

He's probably not a fluke with his power numbers, as evident that he's hit at least 15 HR's per year at an extreme pitcher's park.

Jayhawk Bill · 05-09-2008, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweet Chin Music33

You and I had a discussion about this before.

Hmmm...link, please.

I checked both your user name and my user name on search, found my threads on Greene for Lugo and Crisp, and found nothing from you.

Here's what I had to say:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayhawk Bill

More on Khalil Greene:

BP had a bit on Greene yesterday:

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/ar...articleid=7044

That's the kind of player a smart GM trades, especially if he can get both a starting SS and a starting CF in the deal.

Greene has a career split of .274/.318/.452 in road games at AL ballparks--that's really good for a shortstop. For contrast, Lugo hit .190/.241/.306 on the road last year, but his career line of .200/.333/.320 in PETCO is probably more valuable than Greene's because of the big difference in OBP. (His career interleague mark of .257/.342/.376 is, of course, much better than his PETCO stats.)

I hope the best for Jim Edmonds, a guy who'll garner interest from HoF voters in five or so years. What this means to me is that San Diego needs a CF, and that means discussion of what we might get for Crisp from a team bereft of minor-league talent. This is the best deal that I can conceive as a win-win for both teams, salaries and contracts considered.

a700hitter · 05-09-2008, 08:07 PM

How is Greene's speed? That is probably Lugo's best, and sometimes his only, weapon.

CrespoBlows · 05-09-2008, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a700hitter

How is Greene's speed? That is probably Lugo's best, and sometimes his only, weapon.

Lugo's stolen more bases in one year, than Greene has his entire career.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/playerS...egoryId=142805

Quote:

Baserunning & Defense

Despite the highlights, Greene's range is only average, but he positions himself well, has a quick first step, never lacks for effort and has a decent enough arm to make plays in the hole. In college, he was a basestealing threat, but he really doesn't have the foot speed for that to translate to the majors. He is, however, a very intelligent baserunner.

Jayhawk Bill · 05-09-2008, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a700hitter

How is Greene's speed?

18 SB and 4 CS...career. He understands high-percentage base stealing, so he rarely steals.

In 2007, he was 4-0 stealing bases.

Edit:

If we're talking career, and given the contemporary philosophy that one breaks even at a 3-1 ratio of SB/CS, Greene is +6 career and Lugo is -4 career.

Obviously, Lugo is faster--the value of that extra speed may not be too great.

a700hitter · 05-09-2008, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrespoBlows

Lugo's stolen more bases in one year, than Greene has his entire career.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/playerS...egoryId=142805

Is it that Greene is just not a base stealer or is he a slow-footed MIF. Some guys are fast but can't steal bases.

CrespoBlows · 05-09-2008, 08:19 PM

Quote:

He understands high-percentage base stealing, so he rarely steals.

I agree with this. The Padres are a similar organization to the Red Sox. He's not slow like Pedroia, but he's not Lugo fast. Probably somewhere in between.

Jayhawk Bill · 05-09-2008, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrespoBlows

I agree with this. The Padres are a similar organization to the Red Sox. He's not slow like Pedroia, but he's not Lugo fast. Probably somewhere in between.

Greene isn't fast.

Check 3B/2B ratio, Career:

Greene: 14/131 (.107)
Pedroia: 1/57 (.018)

OK, faster than Pedroia, maybe...but let's check, ummm, JD Drew:

Drew: 37/194 (.191)

Perspective. Greene beats Pedroia and Youk, but he falls short of Drew, a guy a little older who never stole over 19 bases.

Sweet Chin Music33 · 05-09-2008, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayhawk Bill

Hmmm...link, please.

I remember that post you had about Greene a while back, and disagreeing with it, I thought I replied to it......oh well, maybe I had the conversation in my head haha.

Sweet Chin Music33 · 05-09-2008, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a700hitter

Some guys are fast but can't steal bases.

David Dejesus is an example of that.

Soxfan#1 · 05-10-2008, 11:41 PM

How long would we be stuck with Greeney for if we got him?