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Thread: A Realistic View at 2017 Part I

  1. #1951
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    Our pen is not so full of great pitchers that it wouldn't be significantly improved by adding Wright or Pomeranz. There is zero chance ERod starts the year in AAA, unless he's in a horrible funk or recovering from an injury sustained in ST'ing.

    Wright or Pom are better than anyone in our pen, except for Kimbrel and Thornburg.

    We're not sending ERod to AAA not only because he's too valuable, but because keeping Abad or Hembree on the roster is not that important.
    Even with the trade of Buch, spring training still becomes significant. I also think that if he is healthy there is no way E-Rod is sent back but the spring work is going to help sort out how we fill out the starting pitching situation.

  2. #1952
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    Not in favor of a Knuckler coming out of BP in tight situations, or close games. 1 walk, stolen base, pass ball, you can score a deciding run without the benefit of a hit.
    Long relief, if a game is out of hand, to save innings more like it for me. Otherwise I rather Start him, to get his feel for the Pitch, you can almost tell if a Knuckler has it or not, to see if he should continue.

  3. #1953
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    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    The game where teams hold players back for a variety of reasons all the time? Just a guess.

    The whole "best players make the team" does work for Little League. But - and this is not condoning it, but a fact of MLB - contracts and control rule the Show.

    The Sox chose not to demote but Rodriguez, but if they did do it (and they still might depending how the off-season plays out) it would be to keep control of as many players as possible. This kind of thing happens all the time with all 30 teams.

    It was the reason for the overblown Tommy LaStella Retirement Threat last season. (Maybe that wasn't as big of a deal in Boston as it was here in Chicago. If so, apologies for the hopefully not obscure reference.)
    I really don't think that it is a stretch to say that in most cases, teams tend to play their best players. Those that for some reason choose to not play their best, might not win as often. I'm not saying that it can't happen, but it would seem very unlikely and unusual to me that if E-Rod is healthy and well and throwing better than the other two this spring, that he would get sent back. It would seem even more unusual now that DD seems to be a "win now" mode.

  4. #1954
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    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    Probably true, but the off-season is still young. Untold bargains are sometimes found in January. As are crazy impulsive decisions

    Bear in mind our decision-maker for the team is a guy who once lost a 33 year old DH for one season, and in order to replace him, signed Prince Fielder to a 9 year $214mill contract. And he signed Fielder to that deal on JANUARY 26, long after everyone else had given up bidding on Fielder.

    So who knows? Maybe in mid-January Dombrowski, out of sheer boredom, inks Tyson Ross or Jon Niese or Ivan Nova or whoever to a 1 year $5mill deal just to break up the ennui.
    Yes. This is exactly why I believe we traded Buch too soon.

    It does raise a question with me. When to player's contracts start and end? Are they structured to begin on January 1 of the year? Do they begin at the start of ST? Or some other date certain with each player's contract date being different?

    It matters (a little) because as in the case of Buch, if his contract starts on Jan. 1 and we traded him on June 30 we'd owe him ~$6.7M which would count toward our LT, but if his contract starts on.... say.... April 1, we'd only owe him ~$3.4M. That $3.4 million difference could be very significant if we're bumping up against the LT ceiling.
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  5. #1955
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    Quote Originally Posted by cp176 View Post
    I really don't think that it is a stretch to say that in most cases, teams tend to play their best players. Those that for some reason choose to not play their best, might not win as often. I'm not saying that it can't happen, but it would seem very unlikely and unusual to me that if E-Rod is healthy and well and throwing better than the other two this spring, that he would get sent back. It would seem even more unusual now that DD seems to be a "win now" mode.
    Well, were the 2015 Cubs in "win now" mode when they kept Kris Bryant down for 10 weeks? They certainly didn't do it because they thought opening day third baseman Mike Olt was the better player.

    Teams do this kind of thing all the time, and some who don't sometimes find they should have. For example, if the Nationals were dead set on sticking to an innings limit on then rookie Stephen Strasburg, would it have made sense to wait until June to bring him up and have him for the post-season? Or were they right shutting him down prematurely and going into the post-season with Ross Detwiler making starts in the NLDS?

  6. #1956
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    The guys we risk losing are 1 or possibly two from these out of options pitchers: Abad, Hembree & Elias.

    I'd rather put Barnes or Ross in AAA, if we really felt we needed to keep all three of them. Even Kelly has an option left and might be a better choice than ERod.
    Ross is better than Barnes, Abad, Hembree and Elias..
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    ( I won't say the "C word.")

  7. #1957
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    Wright is the 6th starter, imo. I'm not the biggest ERod fan, but I'd rather have him be a starter than Wright. My guess is that one of the starters will be injured in April/May and Wright will get a ton of opportunities to get into the rotation.
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    ( I won't say the "C word.")

  8. #1958
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flap View Post
    think Eduardo is one of our best 5 starters as well, both now and going forward...I just don't think he's separated himself enough from the other two guys at this point that it's ridiculous to even talk about.
    Yup, I think everyone sees Eduardo's potential.
    He just hasn't been consistent enough yet.
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  9. #1959
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flap View Post
    think Eduardo is one of our best 5 starters as well, both now and going forward...I just don't think he's separated himself enough from the other two guys at this point that it's ridiculous to even talk about.
    I don't think it's ridiculous to talk about.

    Things that are ridiculous: DFA Sale, Price or Porcello. Trade Betts. Beni should start the season in AAA. Kimbrel should become a starter.
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    ( I won't say the "C word.")

  10. #1960
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    I think Eduardo is one of our best 5 starters as well, both now and going forward...I just don't think he's separated himself enough from the other two guys at this point that it's ridiculous to even talk about.

    (Reposting because the mobile version of this site keeps deleting my post when I go to edit it..? Sorry.)

  11. #1961
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flap View Post
    I think Eduardo is one of our best 5 starters as well, both now and going forward...I just don't think he's separated himself enough from the other two guys at this point that it's ridiculous to even talk about.

    (Reposting because the mobile version of this site keeps deleting my post when I go to edit it..? Sorry.)
    The mistake is in using the mobile version of the site. Even on my phone, I use the full version.
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    ( I won't say the "C word.")

  12. #1962
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    I don't think it's ridiculous to talk about.

    Things that are ridiculous: DFA Sale, Price or Porcello. Trade Betts. Beni should start the season in AAA. Kimbrel should become a starter.
    Yeah, I wasn't referring to your post, but some of the earlier ones. Someone called it stupid and dumb a page or two back.

  13. #1963
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    The mistake is in using the mobile version of the site. Even on my phone, I use the full version.
    Sound advice.

  14. #1964
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    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    Well, were the 2015 Cubs in "win now" mode when they kept Kris Bryant down for 10 weeks? They certainly didn't do it because they thought opening day third baseman Mike Olt was the better player.

    Teams do this kind of thing all the time, and some who don't sometimes find they should have. For example, if the Nationals were dead set on sticking to an innings limit on then rookie Stephen Strasburg, would it have made sense to wait until June to bring him up and have him for the post-season? Or were they right shutting him down prematurely and going into the post-season with Ross Detwiler making starts in the NLDS?
    I guess you proved your point. Teams do sometimes do this. I think that it always is debateable whether it is the right call or not. Sometimes they get it right and sometimes they don't. I'm not sure that it happens all the time but I do realize that it happens.

  15. #1965
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flap View Post
    I don't know why some are acting like this is such a black-and-white decision. Assuming everyone is healthy and looks strong in camp, would starting Wright and Pomeranz (both All-Stars in 2016) over Rodriguez out of the gate really be so indefensible?
    Pretty close, in my mind, because of the pen. Wright or Pom in the pen greatly improves it.

    ERod in AAA does nothing for our pen, except to maybe allow us to hold onto Abad or Hembree, which is nothing a creative DL can't handle.

    Pom & Wright both have pen experience and could provide long and middle relief like nobody else in our pen, except maybe Kelly, but I think grooming him for the 7th or 8th inning set-up man makes more sense. However, if we are going to view Kelly as a possible spot starter and use him as the long man to start the year, I guess starting ERod in AAA could happen. I still think he'd have to be struggling in ST'ing for that to even be a consideration.

    Just my opinion.

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