Red Sox 2012/2013 Offseason Thread - Page 268 - Talksox

Bellhorn04 · 02-01-2013, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a700hitter

I am not sure what point these stats make. He raked our pitching for those 5 years. In each of those 5 years, he hit Sox pitching for the highest or second highest OPS of any team that he faced in 10 or more games. In 2 of the 5 seasons, he hit Sox pitching for a higher OPS at home than at Fenway. Are you trying to make the point that he didn't hit Sox pitching well?

I'm trying to make the point that Overbay's .895 OPS at Fenway is much higher than the average OPS of opposing hitters at Fenway. It seems reasonable that having an OPS that high at Fenway is attributable more to it being a park that's well suited to him than it is to bad pitching. Don't you think certain hitters are better suited to certain parks?

BSN07 · 02-01-2013, 08:49 AM

If Overbay is on the team it will only be to rest Napoli occasionally or be the late inning defensive replacement late in games because he is good with the glove. I don't think he's going to be part of a true platoon. So I don't think people need to worry so much. Sox needed a LHH 1B that was ok with a minor league deal and a shot to be a bench player. Anyone who is better then Overbay is likely going to get a better deal then that in some form or another.

a700hitter · 02-01-2013, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bellhorn04

I'm trying to make the point that Overbay's .895 OPS at Fenway is much higher than the average OPS of opposing hitters at Fenway. It seems reasonable that having an OPS that high at Fenway is attributable more to it being a park that's well suited to him than it is to bad pitching. Don't you think certain hitters are better suited to certain parks?

I think it is more a function of seeing our pitching a lot plus other than Lester in those last few years we had no effective lefty starters. Did we have any lefty starters in those season. We also had very few lefties in the pen. Did the ballpark also factor into it? Maybe, but remember that in 2 of the 5 season his OPS was higher against us at home than on the road, so I don't think any Fenway effect is enough to justify signing an over the hill substandard offensive first baseman. They should have looked to get a little more pop.

a700hitter · 02-01-2013, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSN07

If Overbay is on the team it will only be to rest Napoli occasionally or be the late inning defensive replacement late in games because he is good with the glove. I don't think he's going to be part of a true platoon. So I don't think people need to worry so much. Sox needed a LHH 1B that was ok with a minor league deal and a shot to be a bench player. Anyone who is better then Overbay is likely going to get a better deal then that in some form or another.

As disappointing as our last 2 off seasons have been, I haven't gotten to the point where I judge a move to be a success, because it will not hurt us. I look to see if a transaction will make us better. Overbay doesn't improve this team. I disagree with your assumption that anyone better than Overbay would get a better deal than being a part time first baseman. If we got a guy who could play the OF and 1B, we could offer him significant playing time and we would fill 2 of our needs. This move doesn't help the team and it probably puts either Nava or Sweeney on the opening day roster to fill the OF spot. Both of them stink.

mvp 78 · 02-01-2013, 10:43 AM

Ladies and gentlemen, your AAA 1b: Lyle Overbay.

Dojji · 02-01-2013, 10:46 AM

I'm not nearly so sure that Overbay is AAA bound. He has definite utility as a very solid defensive 1B and he bats LHH and hits righties decently. .751 OPS v. right in a very bad year last year, .821 career.

As a situational lefty and a LIDR, I see a potentially useful bench player. Not a guy who you'd mistake for a starter, but maybe the guy who will play the other, say, 30 games as our 1B, come in defensively, and pinch hit a bit.

Now, I did want Garrett Jones. But the way our roster is kind of put together on hope and dreams, rather than being an actual contender this year, if the price on Jones started at, say, Junichi Tazawa and went up from there -- and it could have -- I can see why they went for Overbay instead.

a700hitter · 02-01-2013, 10:56 AM

If Overbay doesn't make the opening day roster, he has an opt out clause in his contract. He will not be our AAA first baseman.

dupree · 02-01-2013, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a700hitter

If Overbay doesn't make the opening day roster, he has an opt out clause in his contract. He will not be our AAA first baseman.

Exactly. He will be on the opening day roster just to insure him to stay with the organization as a bench player. I could see Gomez starting in AAA with Overbay in the bigs then maybe a flip flop of position depending on how each plays to start the year

I thought that Casey Kotchman would have been the sign if they were just signing a 1B. But i dont know what his asking price was and his current offers and what his #s are at Fenway.

What is the current payroll at? Is their any wiggle room below the cap or is it just maxed out now at the luxury tax?

redsoxfan3 · 02-01-2013, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dupree

Exactly. He will be on the opening day roster just to insure him to stay with the organization as a bench player. I could see Gomez starting in AAA with Overbay in the bigs then maybe a flip flop of position depending on how each plays to start the year

I thought that Casey Kotchman would have been the sign if they were just signing a 1B. But i dont know what his asking price was and his current offers and what his #s are at Fenway.

What is the current payroll at? Is their any wiggle room below the cap or is it just maxed out now at the luxury tax?

Speier was calculating we are 17 million under, but Napoli could earn 8 million of that. So I think it is safe to say we have 9 million to work with that we are guaranteed under the LT. I would really like us to use that 9 million on another starter, but the options are slim. Overbay is a backup plan, but I think we should look into a LF/1B that is LH. Overbay's contract is not allocated towards the LT until he at least makes the 40 man roster. His contract will only total 1.5 million. I would like us to make some more moves. Let's look to trade Salty and a reliever.

SoxFanForsyth · 02-01-2013, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redsoxfan3

Speier was calculating we are 17 million under, but Napoli could earn 8 million of that. So I think it is safe to say we have 9 million to work with that we are guaranteed under the LT. I would really like us to use that 9 million on another starter, but the options are slim. Overbay is a backup plan, but I think we should look into a LF/1B that is LH. Overbay's contract is not allocated towards the LT until he at least makes the 40 man roster. His contract will only total 1.5 million. I would like us to make some more moves. Let's look to trade Salty and a reliever.

I would love to get another SP but I am convinced that the FO has the 5 SP set right now, so they're not going to go out and get a Lohse or someone because there is nobody he would replace.

I think he's an upgrade over Doubront and Lackey, and maybe even Dempster myself, but I don't think they'll try to get him.

a700hitter · 02-01-2013, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoxFanForsyth

I would love to get another SP but I am convinced that the FO has the 5 SP set right now, so they're not going to go out and get a Lohse or someone because there is nobody he would replace.

I think he's an upgrade over Doubront and Lackey, and maybe even Dempster myself, but I don't think they'll try to get him.

I agree. Cherries thinks he is set for pitching. He is leaving himself little depth to fall back on if things turn bad. If we finish last again, I think he's toast.

SoxFanForsyth · 02-01-2013, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a700hitter

I agree. Cherries thinks he is set for pitching. He is leaving himself little depth to fall back on if things turn bad. If we finish last again, I think he's toast.

Well, to be fair though, who do you want to go get as a #6 man? Because as a FA, nobody like Lohse is going to sign to be starting in AAA. You could put Doubront in AAA, but that would hamper his development.

They're just in a bad spot, really, because of Lackey. If they had a slot open for one more, then we would be able to upgrade our rotation.

That's why I thought the Sox would unload Doubront this offseason so they could make an acquisition via trade to really upgrade.

I still disagree with you regarding the SP depth. I think they have very good SP depth right now. They just need a better #3. They have 2 #2's followed by 3 #4/5's.

mvp 78 · 02-01-2013, 06:34 PM

Lohse isn't worth the pick they'd give up.

wyo-sox · 02-01-2013, 07:09 PM

I am not as down as everyone on Sweeney. Seems like I remember him playing decent defense and his bat was on fire April - May. Wasn't he one of the best hitters on the team for that time? I think he had a concussion when his numbers started to decline. As a bench guy to step in for a few starts through the year I think he is a good pick up for the money. He is a career .280 hitter.

a700hitter · 02-01-2013, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wyo-sox

I am not as down as everyone on Sweeney. Seems like I remember him playing decent defense and his bat was on fire April - May. Wasn't he one of the best hitters on the team for that time? I think he had a concussion when his numbers started to decline. As a bench guy to step in for a few starts through the year I think he is a good pick up for the money. He is a career .280 hitter.

The guy is 6'4" 240 and he has 1 HOUR in his last 500 plate appearances. That is horrendous. The only thing that he can hit hard is the wall with his fist.