2017/18 Hot Stove Thread

[moonslav59]

It's a New England thing. Over rating our own guys. If we wait without adding, for our young guys to become stars that take us to the title, we might be waiting a long time. We have needs that have to be addressed.

Agreed.

Even World Champs look to improve.

[Jack Flap]

"The front office should consider the effect on our young high performance players of bringing in very highly paid FAs while finagling to keep their salaries low."

I don't get this comment...you don't think Mookie, Xander, et. al. would appreciate the team making efforts to get better?

[Bellhorn04]

Agreed.

Even World Champs look to improve.

Although there are also cases where it's just not realistic for a team to improve, because of impending losses of players to free agency, injuries, financial constraints etc.

Also, let us never forget - it's a zero sum game. If some teams are improving it means some teams have to be getting worse.

[Bellhorn04]

"The front office should consider the effect on our young high performance players of bringing in very highly paid FAs while finagling to keep their salaries low."

I don't get this comment...you don't think Mookie, Xander, et. al. would appreciate the team making efforts to get better?

In terms of playing the games, sure they would. On the other hand if you're someone like JBJ or Xander you might also recognize that the team's ability to give you the extension offer you were hoping for may have just disappeared...

[Nick]

In terms of playing the games, sure they would. On the other hand if you're someone like JBJ or Xander you might also recognize that the team's ability to give you the extension offer you were hoping for may have just disappeared...

This is where player's union does not do a very good job fighting for its members.

We've already discussed how the team revenue is increasing at much higher rate than the luxury tax thresh hold. Owners are pocketing big chunk of the money.

I would like for union to fight for incorporating 'team discount' into luxury tax computation. Here's how this would work.
Whatever team a player qualifies as a 'Rookie', that team becomes his home team.
You then put a cap on Annual Average Salary on that player regardless of actual contract.
So in case of Mookie Betts, Sox signs him to $300M contract over 10 years or average of $30M per year. But because Red Sox is his home team, his contract is valued at say $25M. That $25M number is an artificial number. It can be tied to something similar to how the qualifying offer is computed.
This would give Red Sox a leg up on signing Betts. What does the Union care? It gets what it wants. Overall player salary is going up. Fan base is happy.

Or say in case of Sandoval. If a player is released outright, then his contract at the time of the release goes away for the purpose of luxury tax computation for the releasing team. What the hell does union care? Red Sox is now in position to spend additional $20M 'obligation' it just got rid of. Obviously its still on the hook for balance of his contract.

I really think Players' Union does not do enough.

[moonslav59]

Although there are also cases where it's just not realistic for a team to improve, because of impending losses of players to free agency, injuries, financial constraints etc.

Also, let us never forget - it's a zero sum game. If some teams are improving it means some teams have to be getting worse.

I get it, but teams still "look to" improve, even if they might realize they are getting worse. (Maybe they look to not get even more worse.)

I do think the Sox are looking to get better- to have a better opening day roster than last year, at least on paper.

We could get better by just having Devers, Price, Wright, Smith and others for a full season, but I think we're going to try to upgrade our clean-up slot in the line-up and/or 1B (which might be the same move).

[moonslav59]

This is where player's union does not do a very good job fighting for its members.

We've already discussed how the team revenue is increasing at much higher rate than the luxury tax thresh hold. Owners are pocketing big chunk of the money.

I would like for union to fight for incorporating 'team discount' into luxury tax computation. Here's how this would work.
Whatever team a player qualifies as a 'Rookie', that team becomes his home team.
You then put a cap on Annual Average Salary on that player regardless of actual contract.
So in case of Mookie Betts, Sox signs him to $300M contract over 10 years or average of $30M per year. But because Red Sox is his home team, his contract is valued at say $25M. That $25M number is an artificial number. It can be tied to something similar to how the qualifying offer is computed.
This would give Red Sox a leg up on signing Betts. What does the Union care? It gets what it wants. Overall player salary is going up. Fan base is happy.

Or say in case of Sandoval. If a player is released outright, then his contract at the time of the release goes away for the purpose of luxury tax computation for the releasing team. What the hell does union care? Red Sox is now in position to spend additional $20M 'obligation' it just got rid of. Obviously its still on the hook for balance of his contract.

I really think Players' Union does not do enough.

I don't think restricting a player's salary helps the "overall" salaries go up. If they give less to Bogey, it doesn't mean they will give it to JBJ.

The highest salaries are what drives the next highest salaries. The next highest drives the next group just below them.

Look at arbitration. It keeps players on their team and severely restricts their salary for several years. They often get "rewarded" after the fact by big FA contracts that look like an overpay, but in many cases they were "underpaid" before free agency.

This is entertainment. Look what Oprah makes

[Bellhorn04]

This is where player's union does not do a very good job fighting for its members.

We've already discussed how the team revenue is increasing at much higher rate than the luxury tax thresh hold. Owners are pocketing big chunk of the money.

I would like for union to fight for incorporating 'team discount' into luxury tax computation. Here's how this would work.
Whatever team a player qualifies as a 'Rookie', that team becomes his home team.
You then put a cap on Annual Average Salary on that player regardless of actual contract.
So in case of Mookie Betts, Sox signs him to $300M contract over 10 years or average of $30M per year. But because Red Sox is his home team, his contract is valued at say $25M. That $25M number is an artificial number. It can be tied to something similar to how the qualifying offer is computed.
This would give Red Sox a leg up on signing Betts. What does the Union care? It gets what it wants. Overall player salary is going up. Fan base is happy.

Or say in case of Sandoval. If a player is released outright, then his contract at the time of the release goes away for the purpose of luxury tax computation for the releasing team. What the hell does union care? Red Sox is now in position to spend additional $20M 'obligation' it just got rid of. Obviously its still on the hook for balance of his contract.

I really think Players' Union does not do enough.

I was quite surprised by the relatively small increases in luxury tax thresholds and some of the additional tax threshold-related penalties in the last agreement.

It's almost like the owners did a great job convincing the players that the revenue bubble was just about to burst.

[moonslav59]

I was quite surprised by the relatively small increases in luxury tax thresholds and some of the additional tax threshold-related penalties in the last agreement.

It's almost like the owners did a great job convincing the players that the revenue bubble was just about to burst.

...and you do hear many teams saying they want to reset the luxury tax, like the Sox did this year.

[Nick]

I don't think restricting a player's salary helps the "overall" salaries go up. If they give less to Bogey, it doesn't mean they will give it to JBJ.

The highest salaries are what drives the next highest salaries. The next highest drives the next group just below them.

Look at arbitration. It keeps players on their team and severely restricts their salary for several years. They often get "rewarded" after the fact by big FA contracts that look like an overpay, but in many cases they were "underpaid" before free agency.

This is entertainment. Look what Oprah makes

Did you read my post at all? Who said anything about 'restricting'. Isn't one reason you're advocating signing Stanton is due to his salary value of $25M? Sox at some point can spend 'savings' on another player for say $5M. Fake money says $30M but in reality players are getting paid $35M ($30M for Stanton and $5M for the other guy).

[moonslav59]

Did you read my post at all? Who said anything about 'restricting'. Isn't one reason you're advocating signing Stanton is due to his salary value of $25M? Sox at some point can spend 'savings' on another player for say $5M. Fake money says $30M but in reality players are getting paid $35M ($30M for Stanton and $5M for the other guy).

Sorry. I misread your point. My bad.

[notin]

In terms of playing the games, sure they would. On the other hand if you're someone like JBJ or Xander you might also recognize that the team's ability to give you the extension offer you were hoping for may have just disappeared...

If either Bradley or Bogaerts had any interest in an extension, then neither would have hired Scott Boras...

[Nick]

If either Bradley or Bogaerts had any interest in an extension, then neither would have hired Scott Boras...

I think they were Scott Boras client from get go. But you are correct. He thinks there's nothing to gain by extending. Of course, he did fail Mr. Drew.

[harmony]

FanGraphs columnist Craig Edwards estimates the payroll space for each MLB team:

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/an-e...-payroll-room/

[bosoxmal]

Is therea hread for trade rumors! I thought that this was that thread. Why foes anyone give a shit about who makes what. (Maybe they should do it like the Army does. Then give a pension after 22 years.

Bottom line: Who will be out 2018 cleanup hitter. I can almost guaratee that by 2020 it will be Devers. But in the meantime????