Chamberlin or Hughes?

[BSN07]

Guys this is my 1st thread in the Yankees forum,

So who do you like more Chamberlin or Hughes? Hughes has shown bright patches but hasn't been consistant, understandable for a 1st year starter.

On the other hand Chamberlin has come out running on all cylinders and has broke onto the seen like Papelbon did last year. This guy has some great stuff, if he can stay healthy and keep his weight in check he will be really good.

Right now I take Chamberlin out of the pen over Hughes starting.

[jacksonianmarch]

the best thing is we dont have to choose. Chamberlain has the highest ceiling, there is no doubt about that. I think both of them are pitching well in the rotation next season.

[Gom]

Is there any doubt whatsoever to this question? While Chamberlain is the first pitcher since 1900 to have a zero era and strike out a batter in every inning he has pitched in since he came up [that streak ended after he got ejected in the finale of our sweep of the Sox], Hughes has been outright atrocious.

We should have traded this guy when his stock was high. We have a future Jaret Wright on our hands.

[jacksonianmarch]

Once again, Gom, Hughes is 21 yrs old, sustained a pretty significant injury and just doesnt look ready right now. Most every pitcher starts off with some bumps and bruises. Hughes is getting his right now.

[Gom]

Jacko...seriously, what have you SEEN from this kid that you like so far? I don't pay all that attention to the minors because I don't watch them, and I believe what I see. Now maybe you have access to watching the minors where I don't, but I don't believe press clippings or scouting reports as much as you do. They are subjective.

I haven't SEEN anything I like from this kid. His fastball is subpar, he has zero control of his breaking pitches [although they do have a nasty bite to them], and his command is non-existant. Seriously, what impresses you about him? His press clippings? I've watched every one of his starts, and I don't see anything that makes me think he will be dominant.

[jacksonianmarch]

Gom, once again, your analysis is far from objective. First of all, I have seen Hughes a couple times in person. Right now his velocity is a bit down, and it has been down since he came back from his injury. And again, his fastball location has seemed to tail off the last 2 starts. But he has a deep arsenal, a track record of great control and will eventually be a mainstay of our rotation. He just isnt ready right now. There are plenty of guys who come up and suck initially, then put it together and become dominant. This will be Hughes.

As a matter of fact, the only rookies who come up and dominate right away are those with freak show stuff like Chamberlain and Liriano. Hughes has good stuff and a deep arsenal, he just isnt putting it together consistently enough to be effective. He will have a starting spot in the rotation and having a season under his belt while entering a yr healthy can only be good for him.

[Gom]

I hope you are right. I wasn't debating whether or not you've seen him, I was asking. I had never seen him pitch until he came up here.

He may be good, and I hope so. We just don't have time for him to learn right now. You can learn in spring training and the first two months. Not when you are 2 games in front of the Mariners and 4.5 back of the Red Sox. Put up, or go home. If he stinks it up in his next start, it's time for him to go. Do you agree?

[a700hitter]

Gom, once again, your analysis is far from objective. First of all, I have seen Hughes a couple times in person. Right now his velocity is a bit down, and it has been down since he came back from his injury. And again, his fastball location has seemed to tail off the last 2 starts. But he has a deep arsenal, a track record of great control and will eventually be a mainstay of our rotation. He just isnt ready right now. There are plenty of guys who come up and suck initially, then put it together and become dominant. This will be Hughes.

As a matter of fact, the only rookies who come up and dominate right away are those with freak show stuff like Chamberlain and Liriano. Hughes has good stuff and a deep arsenal, he just isnt putting it together consistently enough to be effective. He will have a starting spot in the rotation and having a season under his belt while entering a yr healthy can only be good for him.You do know that personal observation means nothing. Stats rule here.;)

[ORS]

Deep arsenal? He's a two trick pony with a developing change. Deep alright, about as deep as that analysis.

[Gom]

You do know that personal observation means nothing. Stats rule here.;)

I believe in the naked eye as well as statistics. Statistics are a great precursor, and I'd be lost without them. However, he has no statistics, just minor league numbers, which to me, are highly flawed. Until I have a decent statistical base, I look for things in a player. I noticed that Abreu is not stepping in the bucket as much, and guess what? He starts hitting better.

Now, unlike some people, I don't think that it is my observation that made him hit better, just probably one of the major factors that influenced an improvement. For pitchers, when at home, I watch for how much the catcher moves his glove. In other words, how well he hits his spots. A catcher can set up low and outside, and the pitcher totally misses, goes up and in, and the batter swings right through it. Bad pitch, good result. However, I know he's gonna get rocked sooner rather than later. When watching Hughes, he has piss poor control. So I'm not sold on this kids press clippings. I was impressed with Kennedy today, he got a little rattled when Arod dropped a pop up a Tee Ball player should have caught, but other than that, his location was exceptional for a rookie. He pitched better than that bum Hughes has all season in any of his starts, save for the Texas one.

[jacksonianmarch]

I hope you are right. I wasn't debating whether or not you've seen him, I was asking. I had never seen him pitch until he came up here.

He may be good, and I hope so. We just don't have time for him to learn right now. You can learn in spring training and the first two months. Not when you are 2 games in front of the Mariners and 4.5 back of the Red Sox. Put up, or go home. If he stinks it up in his next start, it's time for him to go. Do you agree?

I would agree if you wanted to put Moose in his spot now. He will be good, but I think he is a bit over his head right now. I would still not even hesitate to give him a rotation slot next season out of the gate, no question.

[Gom]

Agreed.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

I love how the Yanks and Sox keep bringing players through at the same positions. Its fun to compare your teams players but I like comparing the teams prospects:

Buchholz vs. Hughes
Papelbon vs. Chamberlain
Ellsbury vs. Cabrera
Pedroia vs. Cano

....good stuff, great player development from both teams