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Thread: A Realistic View at 2019: Part I

  1. #6286
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    I don't know if I would call it a prestige in batting leadoff. There's a common perception based on history that the leadoff hitter is a guy with some speed and an ability to get on base - the 'table-setter'.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  2. #6287
    TalkSox Ascended Master mvp 78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    I don't know if I would call it a prestige in batting leadoff. There's a common perception based on history that the leadoff hitter is a guy with some speed and an ability to get on base - the 'table-setter'.
    I can think of great leadoff hitters, but it's hard to remember great #2 hitters.
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    ( I won't say the "C word.")

  3. #6288
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    I can think of great leadoff hitters, but it's hard to remember great #2 hitters.
    Pedroia
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  4. #6289
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    Pedroia
    Too many DPs.

    Too slow in later years.

    He was great there for a while, though.
    Sox 4 Ever

  5. #6290
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    I can think of great leadoff hitters, but it's hard to remember great #2 hitters.
    I'd like to see....

    1. Beni
    2. Betts
    3. Bogey
    4. JD
    5. Devers
    6. Moreland-Chavis
    7. Chavis-Pearce
    8. JBJ
    9. Vaz-Leon
    Sox 4 Ever

  6. #6291
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    I can think of great leadoff hitters, but it's hard to remember great #2 hitters.

    Roberto Alomar, Mike Trout.

    The thing is, most of the best 2-spot hitters are probably players fans associate with hitting leadoff...

  7. #6292
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    I don't know if I would call it a prestige in batting leadoff. There's a common perception based on history that the leadoff hitter is a guy with some speed and an ability to get on base - the 'table-setter'.

    But is there a certain “prestige” with batting leadoff that would give a player a fit if he suddenly found himself batting second?

  8. #6293
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    Too many DPs.

    Too slow in later years.

    He was great there for a while, though.
    Well yes, I was talking about him in his prime.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  9. #6294
    TalkSox Ascended Master mvp 78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    Pedroia
    Can you name them from non-Sox teams though?

    Leadoff: Lofton, Raines, Rickey

    2nd: ???

    It's so prestigious that it takes me a while to remember if it has a nickname or not.
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    ( I won't say the "C word.")

  10. #6295
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    Can you name them from non-Sox teams though?

    Leadoff: Lofton, Raines, Rickey

    2nd: ???

    It's so prestigious that it takes me a while to remember if it has a nickname or not.
    Roberto Alomar and Trout are great 2-spot hitters

  11. #6296
    TalkSox Ascended Master mvp 78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    Roberto Alomar, Mike Trout.

    The thing is, most of the best 2-spot hitters are probably players fans associate with hitting leadoff...
    Trout has only spent about half his career hitting there.

    Alomar had more games hitting leadoff than 2nd.
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    ( I won't say the "C word.")

  12. #6297
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    But is there a certain “prestige” with batting leadoff that would give a player a fit if he suddenly found himself batting second?
    I would say no. Certainly not now.

    Once upon a time you might say there was some mystique attached to the great leadoff hitters and base stealers like Lou Brock and Rickey Henderson.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  13. #6298
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    Can you name them from non-Sox teams though?

    Leadoff: Lofton, Raines, Rickey

    2nd: ???

    It's so prestigious that it takes me a while to remember if it has a nickname or not.
    I would agree that it's hard to name a lot of great #2 hitters.

    On the other hand, were Manny and Papi great #3 hitters or great #4 hitters?

    The fact is they swapped those spots quite a bit.

    Just like JDM has been doing while he's been with us.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  14. #6299
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp 78 View Post
    Trout has only spent about half his career hitting there.

    Alomar had more games hitting leadoff than 2nd.

    Roberto Alomar has over twice as many plate appearances batting second than he does leading off. He even has more plate appearances batting third than he does leading off.

    Trout has more plate appearances batting second than anywhere else. And over three times as many batting second as he does leading off.

  15. #6300
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    I would say no. Certainly not now.

    Once upon a time you might say there was some mystique attached to the great leadoff hitters and base stealers like Lou Brock and Rickey Henderson.

    I can agree with that.

    Especially now. Players are aware that teams like to use the 2-spot for their best hitters. So if anything, it’s an ego boost and probably carries some prestige.

    To think Betts wants to bat leadoff because of some alleged “prestige” attached to that batting order spot is laughable. Mookie has shown us how he wants his prestige. He wants it negotiated into a long term deal and measurable in USD...

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