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Thread: The rebuild thread.

  1. #391
    King of TalkSox a700hitter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoxFanForsyth View Post
    Disagree. 100 times disagree. The Phillies are going to have a fire sale this winter, count on it. And Hamels will be the first piece to go.

    If the Phillies eat some money, I'll send over some prospects.
    He's the most valuable piece that they have, and without him, they have no rotation. He will stay a Phillie unless he can fleece some team.
    The King of TalkSox has Spoken.

    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    Chaim, you are in the big leagues now. Drawing 10,000 fans a game is not going to cut it, and people don’t buy tickets to Fenway to talk about the Farm

    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    Unlike hot streaks and clutch, the “Cliff” is a myth. It can’t be defined, and it’s future existence cannot be proved.

  2. #392
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palodios View Post
    I agree. Hamels is actually worth the contract he has, so the Red Sox will need to overpay in prospects, or take some money back in a trade. Ruiz/Burnett/Papelbon make some sense here, and with that kind of trade, the Phillies can get out of payroll hell, minus Howard.

    Those players also fill holes for the Red Sox, and are only short-term salaries to take on.
    I could see taking Ruiz and Burnett. They would fill holes, but we probably wouldn't take Papelbon if we are re-signing Koji. If we take two of them and some second tier prospects, I could see it. We are not getting Hamels straight up for second tier prospects.
    The King of TalkSox has Spoken.

    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    Chaim, you are in the big leagues now. Drawing 10,000 fans a game is not going to cut it, and people don’t buy tickets to Fenway to talk about the Farm

    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    Unlike hot streaks and clutch, the “Cliff” is a myth. It can’t be defined, and it’s future existence cannot be proved.

  3. #393
    Quote Originally Posted by SoxFanForsyth View Post
    Jon Heyman is reporting that the Sox are going to make a very strong, aggressive push for Stanton this winter.

    Can you imagine Stanton and Cespedes as your corner outfielders? My goodness.
    My goodness??? What the hell are we going to do for starting pitching SFF? We could score seven or eight runs a game and still lose 90 of them with the garbage like Webster and Buchholz toeing the rubber. We need at least two standout starting pitchers and with Prune Face holding on tight to his damned money we will not get them. Unless we do how does another 2014 type season sound. Also we have to trade Bogaerts and Bradley while they still have some interest from other teams. They are lemons. Are you aware that X is hitting less than 130 with RISP. As I said in April we could have a choker on our hands. I will say this August....WE DO HAVE A CHOKER ON OUR HANDS.

  4. #394
    Quote Originally Posted by SoxFanForsyth View Post
    Why aren't they going to get 2 of those pitchers again? They've got loads of money. And they've only got a few places to spend it.

    I can see them working around Allen Craig to have Cespedes and Stanton in the lineup. Either trading Craig in the deal for Stanton, or potentially trading Napoli, since his deal is up in 2015 and a team can't offer a QO if they don't have him all year.

    Just some ideas. Not saying these are better than other ideas, but if you told me I was going into 2015 with a rotation of Lester Shields Kelly Buch RDLR, and this lineup with Stanton in it? I'm good with that.
    Why SFF? Isn't it obvious that Henry has become a cheap bastard and wants to hold onto his money and try winning on the cheap. The Lester tragedy should be proof enough for everyone, and regardless what some say Jon is NOT coming back to Boston. That train has left the station. We are going to have to really pony up to trade for Hamels if he's even available and pay through the nose for Shields. I just don't think Henry will do it. How about another 2014 type season? That's what we have if we don't get those two solid pitchers and get rid of Bradley and use Bogaerts in the trade for Hamelss if the Phillies would even consider taking him off of our hands.

  5. #395
    Your pal, Pal Palodios's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seabeachfred View Post
    Why SFF? Isn't it obvious that Henry has become a cheap bastard and wants to hold onto his money and try winning on the cheap.
    We heard the same exact thing after 2012, and the FO went out and bought 7 expensive free agents. This year, they added AJ and Mujica, and then added Drew for 10 million midseason. These guys aren't cheap, they're frugal. Contrary to what most wives think, there is a big difference between the two.

  6. #396
    Quote Originally Posted by seabeachfred View Post
    My goodness??? What the hell are we going to do for starting pitching SFF? We could score seven or eight runs a game and still lose 90 of them with the garbage like Webster and Buchholz toeing the rubber. We need at least two standout starting pitchers and with Prune Face holding on tight to his damned money we will not get them. Unless we do how does another 2014 type season sound. Also we have to trade Bogaerts and Bradley while they still have some interest from other teams. They are lemons. Are you aware that X is hitting less than 130 with RISP. As I said in April we could have a choker on our hands. I will say this August....WE DO HAVE A CHOKER ON OUR HANDS.
    I'm using this as my sig so that next year, you can have a chuckle at yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by seabeachfred View Post
    Also we have to trade Bogaerts and Bradley while they still have some interest from other teams. They are lemons. Are you aware that X is hitting less than 130 with RISP. As I said in April we could have a choker on our hands. I will say this August....WE DO HAVE A CHOKER ON OUR HANDS.

  7. #397
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    lol

  8. #398
    Quote Originally Posted by example1 View Post
    I just don't see them spending to get Lester back. I would be happy if they did, I just don't see it happening. I can't argue with it. I have a hard time seeing contracts for guys 30+ that end up being successful. Yes, we can say that it would be successful if they won a World Series during that time, but is it really reasonable to base our view of Jon Lester's contract on whether David Ortiz hits an 8th inning 3 run homer to win a pivotal game? Jon Lester's contribution, no matter how great, would be only partially responsible for the World Series. There's a lot of luck involved in that.

    If we want to try to remove the luck from it then we should look at what the pitcher controls, and what the pitcher controls is his performance when pitching. In that regard, Lester has performed very well over the past few years. He could still be very good over the next 6-7 years, but he would have to be producing at his current level through that time to warrant 20+ million a year. The Red Sox are one of the most valuable and prominent franchises in the world in any sport. I can understand why the Sox would think they can fill his role well before those 6-7 years are up, for much less money.
    You know Ex1, you've been posting some pretty impressive shit since you got back on. You must have been thinking and thinking during your absence and I can't see anything that I could criticize----even if I wanted to. I do think that after what went down last season, a total surprise to me, it would be possible to net a World Series Title during a new six year stint for Lester. Since I agree with you that Jon is NOT coming back to Boston, what are the alternatives. Mine are this--One, we trade for Cole Hamels and make a good offer to the Phillies, and two, we need James Shields, no matter what others may think of the guy. Minus that, we are in deep do-do. Now Cherington has to find a way to get us those two good pitchers whether it's the two I mentioned or some others, whoever the hell they may be or wherever they might be now.

  9. #399
    Quote Originally Posted by SoxFanForsyth View Post
    They're not going to get much for a guy who is making $24mm a year, I'll tell you that.

    Amaro is in love with Middlebrooks, so I can see him being in the deal. Eduardo, Middlebrooks, and JBJ could seal it.
    It will take more than WMB and JBJ and Eduardo......like your boy Bogaerts, a SS the Philllies need badly since they need someone to take Rollins' spot or for third where the Phillies are worse off than we are.

  10. #400
    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    When Craig turned his ankle in his first game, my first thought was that he might miss significant time. Afterward, I thought about whether the Sox had checked out the ankle. Our medical staff seems to miss a lot of obvious conditions.

    The more that I think about it I am more convinced that his down performance is directly related to the condition of his ankle. Ankle injuries can be devastating. Fred and Spud and maybe a couple of others remember Tommy Davis. He was a big prospect for the Brooklyn Dodgers who hit the majors with a splash in LA. He was a fleet footed OFer with all the tools. One season in the early 1960's, hit .340 or 350 and knocked in something like 150 runs. The next season he broke his ankle. He played for about 10 more seasons, but he never again approached being the player he had been before the injury. He could hit enough to keep a job, but he became a liability in the field. He became a journeyman playing for the White Sox, Mets, Orioles and A's and maybe some others. Prior to his injury Craig did not have the gifts that Tommy Davis had. 2014 may not be an off year for Craig. It may be his new norm.
    One again you nailed it my friend and made it clear how an ankle injury can derail a career. Fortunately, Craig's injury is nothing close to what Tommy Davis suffered on May 1, 1965. His ankle was shattered and I mean bent and twisted like a pretzel. I remember listening to that game that Saturday evening. Davis came back the next year and hit 313 in a semi-platoon basis but he couldn't field or run anymore. Ankle injuries can be fatal to a player.

  11. #401
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    Quote Originally Posted by seabeachfred View Post
    It will take more than WMB and JBJ and Eduardo......like your boy Bogaerts, a SS the Philllies need badly since they need someone to take Rollins' spot or for third where the Phillies are worse off than we are.
    Before we start dealing away all of our players, lets look at who we already dealt away. Sizemore seems like hes found his form again, Peavey nearly had a perfect game, AJP is hitting 320 avg, Lester is one of the best pitchers in the league... Maybe patience is whats required. Maybe we should chill out and stop demanding production yesterday.

  12. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by reYoukilis View Post
    Before we start dealing away all of our players, lets look at who we already dealt away. Sizemore seems like hes found his form again, Peavey nearly had a perfect game, AJP is hitting 320 avg, Lester is one of the best pitchers in the league... Maybe patience is whats required. Maybe we should chill out and stop demanding production yesterday.
    re--I'd settle for some production from Bogaerts starting tonight. We have not gotten it and what's worse is this guy is totally useless with RISP. As for those guys you mentioned, maybe we could have kept Sizemore a little longer but our team would not play him in CF because they had their pet Bradley out there and also felt Grady couldn't play CF anymore. AJ was just a bad fit for us and let's see how he performs when the book on him gets around. Peavy still hasn't won a game and the Lester trade was the most disastrous thing the Red Sox have done in the past dozen years. So Youk, I think there is more there than meets the eye.

  13. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by reYoukilis View Post
    Before we start dealing away all of our players, lets look at who we already dealt away. Sizemore seems like hes found his form again, Peavey nearly had a perfect game, AJP is hitting 320 avg, Lester is one of the best pitchers in the league... Maybe patience is whats required. Maybe we should chill out and stop demanding production yesterday.
    LOL!! Sarcasm I hope. Plenty of patience buried us in last place. I would have kept Sizemore and sent Bradley to the minors. I also would have kep AJ who can hit a little and DFA'd Ross who in 2 seasons with us can't make it to the Mendoza line, plus he has had Panter Fasciatis (sp) all season long. But the problem hasn't been a lack patience.
    The King of TalkSox has Spoken.

    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    Chaim, you are in the big leagues now. Drawing 10,000 fans a game is not going to cut it, and people don’t buy tickets to Fenway to talk about the Farm

    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    Unlike hot streaks and clutch, the “Cliff” is a myth. It can’t be defined, and it’s future existence cannot be proved.

  14. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by Palodios View Post
    The Lackey trade may end up being a historically bad trade. Fortunately, this means we will see more Mookie.
    Here we are, playing the Cardinals August 8, and JBJ is striking out pathetically while Mookie has been shipped back to AAA. Any theory from anyone as to what is going on??!!

  15. #405
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    Quote Originally Posted by curiousd View Post
    Here we are, playing the Cardinals August 8, and JBJ is striking out pathetically while Mookie has been shipped back to AAA. Any theory from anyone as to what is going on??!!
    When Drew left, he sold JBJ the video he had of Farrell and Cherington in an orgy of hookers and drugs.

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