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Thread: 2018 ESPN Prospects Stuff (Sox Related)

  1. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by jacksonianmarch View Post
    He is goofy and his swing looks peculiar, but he gets the job done. He's this tiny guy who can go on a streak and smack 9 HR in a month then go dormant. I do love the guy, but his biggest calling card had been the speed, which has clearly taken a step back. He is still pesky in the box and still takes his share of walks, so he is still useful. For as rough as the Headley deal seems (the Yankees got about contract value based on FG's strange value metric) like a loss, the Gardner deal was a big boon for us. The question is, do we decline Gardy's option next year to free up room for Harper? Do we pick it up and deal him? ( He will have 10 and 5 rights). I am not sure.
    I just love him, no way we decline his option next year, Cashman loves this guy, his production needs to fall off a cliff for that to happen. And he's a great clubhouse presence, that alone makes him worth the roster spot.

  2. #167
    El mar no cesa iortiz's Avatar
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    I'm not worry at all, they can rebuild the farm while some of our recent graduates become allstars. We are covered for the next what? 5 years, at least?
    Tiburones Rojos de Veracruz & Boston Red Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by a700hitter View Post
    In the words of Don Corleone when he slaps a crying Johnny Fontaine: "Act like a man!" No, offense ladies.

  3. #168
    Rebuilding the farm is always the goal and inevitable. Even with a low first round pick you can strike gold, Aaron Judge, and Mike Trout were selected 32nd and 25th overall in the first round. I think the concern, or perhaps a better term the hurdle to cross is rebuilding the system under current CBA rules.

    The Sox have done very well over the years to take advantage of loopholes in the draft. In the past, you could receive multiple first-round picks, and spend without much consequence. The MLB draft is a different animal in that you can draft an HS player who can elect to not sign and go to college. Some examples of guys the Sox have drafted out of highschool who didnt' sign and came back into the draft to sign much higher have been

    You can't spend more than 5% over your cap without losing draft picks. This system didn't exist until recently. In a year like 2011, the Sox not only had multiple first rounds picks but they had a larger bank. They could draft Swihart, JBJ, Barnes, and Owens in the first round. That's 6.65 million dollars alone in the first round which is more money than they had to spend in 3 of the last 4 drafts overall. On top of all that they still had 750K to throw at Mookie Betts and 4 million overall outside the first round.

    That type of playing field to pump talent into your system is just not there for the Sox. That doesn't mean it won't happen, that doesn't mean other big market teams aren't facing the same issue but it does raise the question as to how.....how is this going to happen. The pipeline that has fed the Sox system for years has recently been re-routed to allow smaller market teams more money and access to pump their systems with talent.

    The international pool of talent has been one way the Sox had solved this issue in recent years, but they went a little too overboard and lost two years of signing players and the rules for the J2S period have changed as well.

    It will be interesting to see what the Sox do going forward, perhaps they try to trade more to build their system up. Perhaps they roll out with 2 DSL teams and try to find/develop talent through numbers instead of QTY. These are 16-year-old kids by the way.

    This seems to be the picture me and others have painted in the past when we've talked about a cliff! but perhaps the word cliff is a bit misleading and inappropriate as cliff implies we know what is going to happen. I suppose a better way to illustrate it would be to say we're driving down a road and rather than a cliff coming up ahead, the path has become very foggy.

  4. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by iortiz View Post
    I'm not worry at all, they can rebuild the farm while some of our recent graduates become allstars. We are covered for the next what? 5 years, at least?
    1) It's a lot harder to rebuild the farm with the new rules, especially when you are winning 4-6 years in a row.
    2) 5 years? If we keep every essential player who will become a FA in the next 5 years, our budget will be over $300M.
    3) The window looks to be 2-3 more years, unless something happens that is not, at this time, probable.

  5. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by A Red Sox fan named Hugh View Post
    Rebuilding the farm is always the goal and inevitable. Even with a low first round pick you can strike gold, Aaron Judge, and Mike Trout were selected 32nd and 25th overall in the first round. I think the concern, or perhaps a better term the hurdle to cross is rebuilding the system under current CBA rules.

    The Sox have done very well over the years to take advantage of loopholes in the draft. In the past, you could receive multiple first-round picks, and spend without much consequence. The MLB draft is a different animal in that you can draft an HS player who can elect to not sign and go to college. Some examples of guys the Sox have drafted out of highschool who didnt' sign and came back into the draft to sign much higher have been

    You can't spend more than 5% over your cap without losing draft picks. This system didn't exist until recently. In a year like 2011, the Sox not only had multiple first rounds picks but they had a larger bank. They could draft Swihart, JBJ, Barnes, and Owens in the first round. That's 6.65 million dollars alone in the first round which is more money than they had to spend in 3 of the last 4 drafts overall. On top of all that they still had 750K to throw at Mookie Betts and 4 million overall outside the first round.

    That type of playing field to pump talent into your system is just not there for the Sox. That doesn't mean it won't happen, that doesn't mean other big market teams aren't facing the same issue but it does raise the question as to how.....how is this going to happen. The pipeline that has fed the Sox system for years has recently been re-routed to allow smaller market teams more money and access to pump their systems with talent.

    The international pool of talent has been one way the Sox had solved this issue in recent years, but they went a little too overboard and lost two years of signing players and the rules for the J2S period have changed as well.

    It will be interesting to see what the Sox do going forward, perhaps they try to trade more to build their system up. Perhaps they roll out with 2 DSL teams and try to find/develop talent through numbers instead of QTY. These are 16-year-old kids by the way.

    This seems to be the picture me and others have painted in the past when we've talked about a cliff! but perhaps the word cliff is a bit misleading and inappropriate as cliff implies we know what is going to happen. I suppose a better way to illustrate it would be to say we're driving down a road and rather than a cliff coming up ahead, the path has become very foggy.
    You said it much better than I could have. NIce job!

    Here's a list of players we obtained through supplemental and international picks- something that will not be so easy to do going forward, as you pointed out.

    International:
    Bogaerts
    IGGY & Montas (Peavy > Hembree)
    Lin
    Margot (Kimbrel)
    Moncada & Basabe (Sale)
    Espinoza (Pomeranz)
    Devers
    Velazquez
    plus others

    Ellsbury (who later got us Kopech as a comp pick)
    Hansen
    Buchholz
    Fife
    Brentz
    Ranaudo (R Ross)
    Workman
    Barnes
    Swihart
    JBJ
    Johnson
    Light (Abad)
    Kopech -- our last comp pick (2014)




  6. #171
    Analytics are playing a huge part now. Back in the day, scouts showed up, gushed or poo pooed someone and that was it. Now, theyre grading every pitch on the 20-80 scale. They have velocity, spin rates, exit velocity, launch angle, bat speed, etc. There are far more psychological aspects taken into account as well. The Yanks have been doing this for 3-4 years or so and it has borne serious fruit. I anticipate it will be copied. Also, great organizations scout their own guys more than they scout others, which is the new wave as well. It helps to know who is overhyped and primed for trade and also to identify guys who will be stars who you refuse to deal
    The rebuild is complete.

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