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Thread: Sox Underrated Minor Leaguers

  1. #46
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fan_since_Boggs View Post
    With prospects like Ty Buttrey and D.Feltman, there is no need to resign Kimbrel to the 80-100 million dollar contract that he will demand. Instead, the Red Sox will get a draft pick for Kimbrel. You let the vets compete for the closer role in spring training next year (including J.Kelly, who I would resign). In the long run, Buttrey or Feltman could end up as the Red Sox closer.
    2019 could be the last "window" season. I'm not sure leaving the closing role to Kelly/Thornburg/Buttrey and others is the way to go.

    Maybe we can find a decent bridge closer.

    I would not pay Kimbrel $20M. That's about 1/10 to 1/11th of the luxury tax budget amount.

    It's a major area of concern going forward. Losing HRam and Pom's contracts might help a little, but the arb contracts will see significant upticks next year.

  2. #47
    Deity Kimmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fan_since_Boggs View Post
    With prospects like Ty Buttrey and D.Feltman, there is no need to resign Kimbrel to the 80-100 million dollar contract that he will demand. Instead, the Red Sox will get a draft pick for Kimbrel. You let the vets compete for the closer role in spring training next year (including J.Kelly, who I would resign). In the long run, Buttrey or Feltman could end up as the Red Sox closer.
    I'm with you. There are much less expensive options for a closer who will give you almost the same production as Kimbrel. I don't know whether Buttrey or Feltman are the answer, but someone other than an expensive Kimbrel certainly is.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimmi View Post
    I'm with you. There are much less expensive options for a closer who will give you almost the same production as Kimbrel. I don't know whether Buttrey or Feltman are the answer, but someone other than an expensive Kimbrel certainly is.
    The Sox may also need the closer role for Price if this trend continues...

  4. #49
    The game has changed. Every contending team has flame throwers who can locate at the end of their pen. Kimbrel is the best of them. He is so good that most teams know they need to make their hay in the first 8 innings and will pull out the stops to do so. Losing him will significantly weaker your club. So I say go for it. See if you can replace him internally. And when you turn into the 2018 Indians pen, I will laugh and laugh
    Hal sucks

  5. #50
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacksonianmarch View Post
    The game has changed. Every contending team has flame throwers who can locate at the end of their pen. Kimbrel is the best of them. He is so good that most teams know they need to make their hay in the first 8 innings and will pull out the stops to do so. Losing him will significantly weaker your club. So I say go for it. See if you can replace him internally. And when you turn into the 2018 Indians pen, I will laugh and laugh
    Kimbrel is a tough call. He's great, but he might be looking at $95 million. As great as he is, he entails some serious risk going forward, as all flamethrowers with some mileage on them do.

    I guarantee that Dombrowski loves Kimbrel and I think he'll make him an offer at least. But I think he's already got a Plan B in mind too.

  6. #51
    Deity Kimmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacksonianmarch View Post
    The game has changed. Every contending team has flame throwers who can locate at the end of their pen. Kimbrel is the best of them. He is so good that most teams know they need to make their hay in the first 8 innings and will pull out the stops to do so. Losing him will significantly weaker your club. So I say go for it. See if you can replace him internally. And when you turn into the 2018 Indians pen, I will laugh and laugh
    You never know what you're going to get out of relievers. We could re-sign Kimbrel for to a 4-5 year contract, and our pen could still turn into the Indians 2018 pen. Look at the aforementioned Indians pen. They were second best in baseball in 2017. They are the 3rd worst this year. Three of their biggest arms from last year, Miller, Cody, and Shaw just fell of the cliff this year.

    A huge contract to Kimbrel is just not worth the resources when a very effective closer can be found for much cheaper.

  7. #52
    Deity Kimmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    Kimbrel is a tough call. He's great, but he might be looking at $95 million. As great as he is, he entails some serious risk going forward, as all flamethrowers with some mileage on them do.

    I guarantee that Dombrowski loves Kimbrel and I think he'll make him an offer at least. But I think he's already got a Plan B in mind too.
    Well said Bell.

  8. #53
    Resident Old Fart Spudboy's Avatar
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    I still think Kimbrell can be signed for 3/45 or 3/48.
    "Hating the Yankees like it's a religion since 94'" RIP Mike.


    "It's also a simple and indisputable fact that WAR isn't the be-all end-all in valuations, especially in real life. Wanna know why? Because an ace in run-prevention for 120 innings means more often than not, a sub-standard pitcher covering for the rest of the IP that pitcher fails to provide. You can't see value in a vacuum when a player does not provide full-time production."

  9. #54
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudboy View Post
    I still think Kimbrell can be signed for 3/45 or 3/48.
    That'd be less than Wade Davis got (3/52).

  10. #55
    Resident Old Fart Spudboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    That'd be less than Wade Davis got (3/52).
    okay.

    My point is that I do think that he can be had for less than 5 years. And less than 19-20 mil./year.
    "Hating the Yankees like it's a religion since 94'" RIP Mike.


    "It's also a simple and indisputable fact that WAR isn't the be-all end-all in valuations, especially in real life. Wanna know why? Because an ace in run-prevention for 120 innings means more often than not, a sub-standard pitcher covering for the rest of the IP that pitcher fails to provide. You can't see value in a vacuum when a player does not provide full-time production."

  11. #56
    Resident Old Fart Spudboy's Avatar
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    Are there a bunch of teams looking to spend 100 mil on a closer?
    "Hating the Yankees like it's a religion since 94'" RIP Mike.


    "It's also a simple and indisputable fact that WAR isn't the be-all end-all in valuations, especially in real life. Wanna know why? Because an ace in run-prevention for 120 innings means more often than not, a sub-standard pitcher covering for the rest of the IP that pitcher fails to provide. You can't see value in a vacuum when a player does not provide full-time production."

  12. #57
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudboy View Post
    Are there a bunch of teams looking to spend 100 mil on a closer?
    You're right, it's a fair question.

    The Yankees shelled out 86 million for Chapman and the Dodgers 80 million for Jansen. So that's 2 of the biggest spenders out of play. And I'm not sure how many other teams are willing to spend anywhere near that for a closer.

  13. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    You're right, it's a fair question.

    The Yankees shelled out 86 million for Chapman and the Dodgers 80 million for Jansen. So that's 2 of the biggest spenders out of play. And I'm not sure how many other teams are willing to spend anywhere near that for a closer.
    A ton of teams stayed under the cap this year in order to spend. Kimbrel is the best closer in baseball. Assuming you're getting a deal because of lack of suitors is a fools errand. That's like assuming Bryce Harper won't get paid because the Yanks and Dodgers are pretty well set in the OF
    Hal sucks

  14. #59
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacksonianmarch View Post
    A ton of teams stayed under the cap this year in order to spend. Kimbrel is the best closer in baseball. Assuming you're getting a deal because of lack of suitors is a fools errand. That's like assuming Bryce Harper won't get paid because the Yanks and Dodgers are pretty well set in the OF
    So start with a list of the big spenders who will clearly have an opening at closer next year. That would be a little more scientific than just talking about 'fools errands'.

    I'm pretty sure DD loves Kimbrel and is giving this a lot of attention anyway.

  15. #60
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Opening Day Budget Rankings & their closer (saves leader) 2018 saves

    SFG: Stickland 12

    BOS: Kimbrel 30

    Cubs: Morrow 22

    WSH: Herrera 14

    NYM: Familia 17

    HOU: Giles 12 (recently demoted)

    LAA: Parker 10

    SEA: Diaz 36

    TOR: Clippard 6

    NYY: Chapman 27

    LAD: Jansen 27


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