COVID-19 Non Political Thread

[FredLynn]

Babies and adults are not the same story when it comes to vaccines....even babies and teenagers are not the same mass acceptance candidates for vaccines.
First, you have the people that no longer believe in vaccination FOR ANYTHING, even the stuff that at least in my case was simply automatically done by parents.
Second, you have the people that simply will not stand for that sort of short interval between multiple boosters. A vaccination and a single booster....fine....,multiple boosters....IMO.....good lick with that
Third, you have the people that no longer believe in the integrity of the institution of medicine and THAT is not a small crowd either. Frankly, I really do not think all of these class action suits for medical devices and medicines that one would not have thought would have gone that way are helpful. Not talking about big Pharma and Narcotics here. Those involved pretty straightforward tort for horrible abuses by drug companies. But even those suits do not help people's perception of the drug companies and biochem. Then there is "used talcum power? join our law suit." "Had a hernia mesh used in your treatment, join our law suit." There has been an endless stream of tort v the medical community the last few years and it may or may not be justified. But it is there and the ads drawing people to the class actions are endless. Even if one does not join a suit, one cannot help get the impression that maybe something has gone awry.
Fourth, the trust of Government may never have been lower. So what part will Government play in promoting this vaccine and to what extent will that effort be accepted?
Fifth, whether some of us want to believe it or not even in 2021 we will still be hearing people tell us that they just don't see what the rest of us are worried about or worse, "ITS A HOAX".

All by way of saying that I think it will be a steep uphill battle for a vaccine that requires multiple boosters within short intervals.

That said, I have never thought that a vaccine developed for this bear, this mother of a virus would be a "Kablam, here is your vaccine kind of event." So to me, progress is progress. I simply doubt this particular vaccine in its current formulation will go anywhere. Just my opinion.

Your opinion about those points in valid of course. There are those who won’t get it for the reasons you list. That’s their choice to make. If its effective and allows me to get my life back i will get boosters every two months if I have to. Those who choose not to be vaccinated are, for the most part, only hurting themselves.

[a700hitter]

USA Daily Death Total -- 937

[a700hitter]

Florida Daily New Cases, Daily New Hospitalizations and Daily Deaths:

[a700hitter]

NY State New Daily Cases and Daily Deaths:

[a700hitter]

Arizona New Daily Cases, New Daily Hospitalizations and Daily Deaths:

[mvp 78]

Looks like AZ is doing better than FL.

Also, it has been confirmed that most COVID tests are taking over a week to process. Any changes made to mask ordinances over the previous week won't be seen in COVID cases for a while.

[Kimmi]

I posted this information a while ago when Moderna made it public. The difference here is that it was published after being peer reviewed in a very respectable medical journal.
Slasher I believe is involved with this study- or was it the Astra Zeneca study he was involved with.
Hard to keep them all straight.

Yes, it's hard to keep them all straight. But it sounds like this one has progressed to the next phase with excellent success.

[Kimmi]

I just found out. We are opening up nearly 100% online. They said just very few students will be on campus- my guess is SPED and maybe Beginning/Intermediate ESL.

They will use the first week to teach the safety plans for in- school learning and to set up online protocols, in case we need to shut down school later.

Many parents are irate. Many are relieved.

I'm thinking it's probably a good idea, and since I teach ESL, maybe I'll get my kiddos to start.

Wow, that's interesting. When do your schools open?

Our schools don't open until after Labor Day so we still have almost 2 months to see how things progress. I'm not expecting a decision for another month.

No matter what the schools decide, some parents are going to be irate while others will be happy. No decision is going to make everyone happy.

[Kimmi]

There are many-if not most- vaccines that require multiple doses. For example the Dtap given to babies requires 3 doses at 2,4,and 6 months of age. The hep B vaccine also needs multiple doses, as does the polio vaccine. In fact I can’t off hand think of a single vaccine that works with one dose.
Remember: as relates to this virus we are all babies. None of us has ever seen it before.

Do you know how many Americans get the flu vaccine every year?

One thing to keep in mind is that the yearly deaths from the flu have occurred with a vaccine available. I'm wondering if the # of deaths from the coronavirus would be comparable to flu deaths if there were a vaccine.

[jacksonianmarch]

Babies and adults are not the same story when it comes to vaccines....even babies and teenagers are not the same mass acceptance candidates for vaccines.
First, you have the people that no longer believe in vaccination FOR ANYTHING, even the stuff that at least in my case was simply automatically done by parents.
Second, you have the people that simply will not stand for that sort of short interval between multiple boosters. A vaccination and a single booster....fine....,multiple boosters....IMO.....good lick with that
Third, you have the people that no longer believe in the integrity of the institution of medicine and THAT is not a small crowd either. Frankly, I really do not think all of these class action suits for medical devices and medicines that one would not have thought would have gone that way are helpful. Not talking about big Pharma and Narcotics here. Those involved pretty straightforward tort for horrible abuses by drug companies. But even those suits do not help people's perception of the drug companies and biochem. Then there is "used talcum power? join our law suit." "Had a hernia mesh used in your treatment, join our law suit." There has been an endless stream of tort v the medical community the last few years and it may or may not be justified. But it is there and the ads drawing people to the class actions are endless. Even if one does not join a suit, one cannot help get the impression that maybe something has gone awry.
Fourth, the trust of Government may never have been lower. So what part will Government play in promoting this vaccine and to what extent will that effort be accepted?
Fifth, whether some of us want to believe it or not even in 2021 we will still be hearing people tell us that they just don't see what the rest of us are worried about or worse, "ITS A HOAX".

All by way of saying that I think it will be a steep uphill battle for a vaccine that requires multiple boosters within short intervals.

That said, I have never thought that a vaccine developed for this bear, this mother of a virus would be a "Kablam, here is your vaccine kind of event." So to me, progress is progress. I simply doubt this particular vaccine in its current formulation will go anywhere. Just my opinion.

It’s a reflection of our society as a whole. Everything has a side effect. Everything. Drinking water, breathing oxygen, eating food. It’s all about dosage and frequency. If you drink 6 gallons of water, you’ll drop your serum sodium and could seize. If you breathe pure oxygen and don’t need it, you’ll develop hyperoxia which damages tissues. If you eat too much food, you’ll get fat and suffer from metabolic syndrome. With vaccines, an infinitesimal amount of people receiving them will develop a reaction (and no, not autism). The flu vaccine has an incredibly small risk of Guillan Barre syndrome. Some of the earlier vaccines increased the risk of serum sickness. Here’s the deal, the benefit to the populous is far greater than the tiny risk to a few. The same with medical devices. Most of them are entirely fine. Some of them fail. Some of them take a decade to figure out if they were problematic and you don’t figure it out til after the fact. But our country doesn’t understand the scientific and medical process. They’re under the impression that modern medicine is perfect and all of us will be cured of what ails us and when the treatment causes a problem, it’s the doctor or hospitals fault. We, as a country, have become incredibly self absorbed and we entirely lack the basic understanding of what being in a society is about.

The first covid vaccine will not be perfect. I’m sure it won’t be dangerous, mostly because the adjuvants used will have been tested before in other vaccines, but I’m not sure how long lasting they will be. But guess what, China, Japan and all of Europe will make them mandatory. And if 90% of the population gets immunized and of those 90% gain immunity, even for a short period of time, that’s enough to develop herd immunity and stamp it out. Instead, our dumbass population will whine about the unknown, be unwilling to do it enough to gain herd immunity and the injections will be for naught as we won’t have long lasting immunity from the vaccine and we won’t have enough of a population percentage get the vaccine and allow for herd immunity

[Kimmi]

Looks like AZ is doing better than FL.

Also, it has been confirmed that most COVID tests are taking over a week to process. Any changes made to mask ordinances over the previous week won't be seen in COVID cases for a while.

I am curious to see what effect the mask ordinances will have on Florida's numbers.

Virginia has had a mask mandate since it reopened, but our number of new cases is on the rise.

[jacksonianmarch]

I am curious to see what effect the mask ordinances will have on Florida's numbers.

Virginia has had a mask mandate since it reopened, but our number of new cases is on the rise.

There’s two curves you need to use to determine public health efficacy. The first is new cases. That curve lags two weeks behind any social ordinance aimed to curb the disease. The second is death rate. That lags 2-3 weeks behind the new case curve. So a mask ordinance now may not affect the death rate for 4-5 weeks. That’s the issue we are running into with the population. Mask-on goes live and after a week the population seems it a failure because the new case and case fatality data doesn’t improve.

[mvp 78]

There’s two curves you need to use to determine public health efficacy. The first is new cases. That curve lags two weeks behind any social ordinance aimed to curb the disease. The second is death rate. That lags 2-3 weeks behind the new case curve. So a mask ordinance now may not affect the death rate for 4-5 weeks. That’s the issue we are running into with the population. Mask-on goes live and after a week the population seems it a failure because the new case and case fatality data doesn’t improve.

Also, a lot of nursing homes down here didn't have any COVID cases until the past few weeks. For example, my wife's nana's nursing home had zero cases until about 2 weeks ago. Now, they have 3 residents with COVID and 6 employees. This could really spike the death rates over the next month or so. Considering the aging population down here, there is potential for it to get pretty bad in some locations.

[Kimmi]

There’s two curves you need to use to determine public health efficacy. The first is new cases. That curve lags two weeks behind any social ordinance aimed to curb the disease. The second is death rate. That lags 2-3 weeks behind the new case curve. So a mask ordinance now may not affect the death rate for 4-5 weeks. That’s the issue we are running into with the population. Mask-on goes live and after a week the population seems it a failure because the new case and case fatality data doesn’t improve.

Makes perfect sense. I hope people will give the mask wearing a real chance to succeed.

[jacksonianmarch]

The death rates will skyrocket when the vulnerable populations get it