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Thread: The 2021-2022 Offseason Thread

  1. #1216
    TalkSox Godhead mvp 78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harmony View Post
    Marcels projects free agent righthander Mike Foltynewicz with a 2022 ERA of 4.96 in 127 innings while Steamer projects Foltynewicz with a 2022 ERA of 5.15 in 126 innings:

    https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...oltymi01.shtml

    https://www.fangraphs.com/players/mi...ats?position=P
    I’d only sign him to a MiLB deal.

  2. #1217
    Deity Kimmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dgalehouse View Post
    It wouldn't be the off season without folks griping about how slow it is developing. Happens every year. In my opinion , the Sox don't need to do too much. The lineup is good , with or without Schwarber. Move one , if not both, of Whitlock and Houck to the rotation. Concentrate and spend the resources on strengthening the bullpen. This is where so many games are won or lost these days.
    You had me up until "concentrate and spend the resources on strengthening the bullpen." Actually, I can agree with that too, up to a point, but as I've said many times before, I don't like spending big on the bullpen. That's not to say that the bullpen is not important, I just don't want to spend big on it.

    I think the concentration of resources should be on starting pitching.

  3. #1218
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimmi View Post
    You had me up until "concentrate and spend the resources on strengthening the bullpen." Actually, I can agree with that too, up to a point, but as I've said many times before, I don't like spending big on the bullpen. That's not to say that the bullpen is not important, I just don't want to spend big on it.

    I think the concentration of resources should be on starting pitching.
    I mostly agree, but man, starting pitchers with credentials are pricy.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  4. #1219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimmi View Post
    You had me up until "concentrate and spend the resources on strengthening the bullpen." Actually, I can agree with that too, up to a point, but as I've said many times before, I don't like spending big on the bullpen. That's not to say that the bullpen is not important, I just don't want to spend big on it.

    I think the concentration of resources should be on starting pitching.
    I agree, and to some extent, starters are more known commodities.

    We lost Ottavino, so I think keeping Houck & Whitlock in the pen makes a lot of sense.
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  5. #1220
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    I mostly agree, but man, starting pitchers with credentials are pricy.
    Indeed, but they also pitch double or triple the innings.
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  6. #1221
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    Indeed, but they also pitch double or triple the innings.
    Yes, for quadruple the cost LOL

    Highest contract to starter Cole 324 mill
    Highest contact to reliever Chapman 86 mill
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  7. #1222
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    Yes, for quadruple the cost LOL

    Highest contract to starter Cole 324 mill
    Highest contact to reliever Chapman 86 mill
    Better pitchers.
    Triple the innings.
    Quadruple the cost.

    Sounds good to me.
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  8. #1223
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    Better pitchers.
    Triple the innings.
    Quadruple the cost.

    Sounds good to me.
    We're seeing changes in how pitchers are used, though. Starters throwing fewer innings and relievers more. So that triple innings thing is going down.

    Whitlock pitched 73.1 innings in 2021.

    Top 3 starters by IP

    Eovaldi 182.1 = 2.49 times as many
    E-Rod 157.2 = 2.15
    Pivetta 155.0 = 2.11
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  9. #1224
    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    Yes, for quadruple the cost LOL

    Highest contract to starter Cole 324 mill
    Highest contact to reliever Chapman 86 mill
    Total rings in pinstripes for either: 0

  10. #1225
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    We're seeing changes in how pitchers are used, though. Starters throwing fewer innings and relievers more. So that triple innings thing is going down.

    Whitlock pitched 73.1 innings in 2021.

    Top 3 starters by IP

    Eovaldi 182.1 = 2.49 times as many
    E-Rod 157.2 = 2.15
    Pivetta 155.0 = 2.11
    Yes, but many RP'ers pitch 40-55 innings or 60, so 150-190 is close to quadruple most RP'ers.

    I'd like to see Houck and Whitlock stay in the pen and get between 100-120 IP, each.

    That would eat up the lost Ottavino and Richards pen innings.

    Then, add another RP'er or two to take up the some other IP'd we'd like to see replaced and improved upon.

    Trade for one really good pitcher and sign someone like Jon Gray.
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  11. #1226
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    Yes, but many RP'ers pitch 40-55 innings or 60, so 150-190 is close to quadruple most RP'ers.
    If you compare #1 starters to #1 relievers the ratio has generally been 3 to 1.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  12. #1227
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5GoldGloves:OF,75 View Post
    Total rings in pinstripes for either: 0
    But the Yankees did trade Chapman elsewhere so he could win one…

  13. #1228
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    I think the concentration of resources should be on starting pitching. Kimmi

    I agree, and to some extent, starters are more known commodities.

    We lost Ottavino, so I think keeping Houck & Whitlock in the pen makes a lot of sense.
    Moon

    You are the biggest fence straddler when it comes to this.

    I'd say give both chance to start. Houck & Whitlock may give us terrific starting pitching for two years at $1M.

    Go find pen help.

    Again, aren't you the biggest critiquer when it comes Sox not developing starting pitching? Yet you want to turn every one of them into a reliever. I don't get it.
    Up 2-1 with 2 home games remaining for ACL Championship. I will always return that spot.

  14. #1229
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I think the concentration of resources should be on starting pitching. Kimmi

    I agree, and to some extent, starters are more known commodities.

    We lost Ottavino, so I think keeping Houck & Whitlock in the pen makes a lot of sense.
    Moon

    You are the biggest fence straddler when it comes to this.

    I'd say give both chance to start. Houck & Whitlock may give us terrific starting pitching for two years at $1M.

    Go find pen help.

    Again, aren't you the biggest critiquer when it comes Sox not developing starting pitching? Yet you want to turn every one of them into a reliever. I don't get it.
    I think Iím pretty firm in wanting to acquire a top SPer so we can keep Houck in the pen. Iíd rather add a Jon Gray type and keep Whitlock in the pen, too, but Iím okay with converting him to a starter.

    If one goes to the rotation, we better add some pen help- quality and quantity.
    Sox 4 Ever

  15. #1230
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I think the concentration of resources should be on starting pitching. Kimmi

    I agree, and to some extent, starters are more known commodities.

    We lost Ottavino, so I think keeping Houck & Whitlock in the pen makes a lot of sense.
    Moon

    You are the biggest fence straddler when it comes to this.

    I'd say give both chance to start. Houck & Whitlock may give us terrific starting pitching for two years at $1M.

    Go find pen help.

    Again, aren't you the biggest critiquer when it comes Sox not developing starting pitching? Yet you want to turn every one of them into a reliever. I don't get it.
    BT W I am not the one saying that. It’s not every pitcher either
    Last edited by moonslav59; 11-25-2021 at 05:32 PM.
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