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Thread: The 2021-2022 Offseason Thread

  1. #1
    TalkSox Ascended Master mvp 78's Avatar
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    The 2021-2022 Offseason Thread

    Itís the time of year when everything starts to Bloom.

  2. #2
    I'm not in favor of signing an old, expensive pitcher. Scherzer has a tired, dead arm and can't start with his club facing elimination. He won't be any younger a year from now.

    Meanwhile, pre- primetimers like Vlad and Wander will be even better next season. Stop-gaps won't stop them. The best way for the Red Sox to compete with that kind of talent is to develop their own (including adding players to the system via trades). Bloom could go out and sign this year's version of Teixeira, CC and AJ -- Crankee trivia; see NY's last ring (before my son was born) -- and the Sox still may not get as far as they did this year.

    I prefer dealing for a guy like Berrios -- someone 20-something, with upside, under control. Where are the candidates? Astute posters are already pointing to Oakland, Colorado and Miami...

  3. #3
    Deity Kimmi's Avatar
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    I don't have the time to look into possible trade scenarios and free agent signings like many of you do.

    I trust Bloom. I agree with his philosophy. That's enough for me.

  4. #4
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    It's going to be another interesting one. But once again we better be prepared to be patient. Bloom is not exactly a rapid-fire wheeler-dealer.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  5. #5
    Legend Nick's Avatar
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    What I want and what Bloom will do are two different things.....I trust Bloom. I really don't know much.

    You start with what you have and make improvements.

    C Vaz (no reason to think we won't pick up his option)
    1B Dalbec (he has potential plus he's back up options for Devers, Casas and DH)
    2B Arroyo (we may look to upgrade this position and make him a utility player)
    SS Xander
    3B Devers
    LF Verdugo
    CF Kike
    RF Renfroe (he was a bargain at $3M)
    DH JD

    We'll know shortly after the World Series, what JD will do. Not too much concern here. If he opts out, we have $22M to play with. Next DH won't be that expensive.

    SP Sale
    SP Eovaldi
    SP Pivetta
    SP ????
    SP ????

    Again we'll know shortly the fate of E Rod.

    Pen
    Barnes (yep, we're stuck with him after giving him a $5M raise, his trade value is all time low)
    Whitlock
    Houck
    Brasier
    Darwinzon
    Taylor
    Sawamura
    Valdez (?)

    The bullpen may take work especially if one or two are moved to starter status

    Is this lineup (assuming JD returns and E Rod stays) good enough to win the Division? We were 8 back. Probably not.

    Pluses
    We'll have Sale for entire year and he maybe improving.
    I would expect Pivetta to continue to get better.
    Eovaldi has become a pitcher, not just a guy that throws 100mph.
    Minuses
    Barnes falling off the ridge.
    Not sure if defense can improve.
    Last edited by Nick; 10-24-2021 at 10:00 AM.
    Not over till the fat lady sings.

  6. #6
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    What I want and what Bloom will do are two different things.....I trust Bloom. I really don't know much.

    You start with what you have and make improvements.

    C Vaz (no reason to think we won't pick up his option)
    1B Dalbec (he has potential plus he's back up options for Devers, Casas and DH)
    2B Arroyo (we may look to upgrade this position and make him a utility player)
    SS Xander
    3B Devers
    LF Verdugo
    CF Kike
    RF Renfroe (he was a bargain at $3M)
    DH JD

    We'll know shortly after the World Series, what JD will do. Not too much concern here. If he opts out, we have $22M to play with. Next DH won't be that expensive.

    SP Sale
    SP Eovaldi
    SP Pivetta
    SP ????
    SP ????

    Again we'll know shortly the fate of E Rod.

    Pen
    Barnes (yep, we're stuck with him after giving him a $5M raise, his trade value is all time low)
    Whitlock
    Houck
    Brasier
    Darwinzon
    Taylor
    Sawamura
    Valdez (?)

    The bullpen may take work especially if one or two are moved to starter status

    Is this lineup (assuming JD returns and E Rod stays) good enough to win the Division? We were 8 back. Probably not.

    Pluses
    We'll have Sale for entire year and he maybe improving.
    I would expect Pivetta to continue to get better.
    Eovaldi has become a pitcher, not just a guy that throws 100mph.
    Minuses
    Barnes falling off the ridge.
    Not sure if defense can improve.
    Nice summary.

    I'm not sure I have ever seen an off season where just about all our free agents to be are additions by subtractions or close to it.

    ERod is good, but at $18.5M (QO), there are likely pitchers similar to him that can be signed.

    Ottavino's numbers were deceivingly good. He can be replaced at $8M.

    As you pointed out, if JD opts out, we have $22M cleared from the lux tax ($19.4M in actual salary.)

    A lot depends on what Bloom's winter budget is, what the new tax laws are going to be, and how Bloom spends the budget. It should be pointed out that Bloom swung and missed with a big chunk of his winter signings, last year, and a bigger budget does not mean he'll do better. He actually did worse with his biggest signings and additions:

    $10M Richards
    $8M Ottavino
    $7M x 2 Kike (Great deal)
    $6M Perez
    $3M Marwin
    $3M Andriese
    $3M Renfroe (Great deal)
    $2M Santana
    $1.5M Sawamura (OK deal)
    Sox 4 Ever

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post

    Ottavino's numbers were deceivingly good. He can be replaced at $8M.


    Something like ('21 salaries, in millions): Wisler $2 + Kittredge $1.5 + Anderson $1 + Fairbanks $.5 + Rasmussen $.5 + Feyereisen $.5 + Thompson $.5 + Chargois $.5 + Flemming $.5...

  8. #8
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5GoldGloves:OF,75 View Post
    Something like ('21 salaries, in millions): Wisler $2 + Kittredge $1.5 + Anderson $1 + Fairbanks $.5 + Rasmussen $.5 + Feyereisen $.5 + Thompson $.5 + Chargois $.5 + Flemming $.5...
    It's hard to acquire guys like that via trade an impossible via free agency.
    Sox 4 Ever

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by moonslav59 View Post
    It's hard to acquire guys like that via trade an impossible via free agency.
    All at once, yes... but a couple this year, then swap one for a couple more next year, then the next, and before you know it: you win 100 games and finish first without any full-time starting pitchers...

    But that's just one method of bullpen-building. It can help you throw a shutout in the opener of the ALDS, but you also risk getting your doors blown in three straight when an opponent with a stacked line-up exploits a weak reliever or two who just aren't on in each day's endless parade to the mound.

  10. #10
    Keeping both J.D. and Schwarber , while a bit redundant, could be a good idea if the Sox are willing to spend what it takes to do it. But the main task this off season has to be improving the pitching, especially the bullpen. In today's game , having a strong and reliable bullpen is absolutely vital.
    Old school is good school.

  11. #11
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dgalehouse View Post
    Keeping both J.D. and Schwarber , while a bit redundant, could be a good idea if the Sox are willing to spend what it takes to do it. But the main task this off season has to be improving the pitching, especially the bullpen. In today's game , having a strong and reliable bullpen is absolutely vital.
    We may get to the point we don't even talk about starting rotations and bullpens any more, just pitching staffs.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    We may get to the point we don't even talk about starting rotations and bullpens any more, just pitching staffs.
    Boy watching some of these post season games.. it sure seems to be heading in that direction. You get three innings from your table setter aka opener and then mix and match for six innings.

  13. #13
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YastrzemskI View Post
    Boy watching some of these post season games.. it sure seems to be heading in that direction. You get three innings from your table setter aka opener and then mix and match for six innings.
    Yeah, gone are the days when you thought the goal was to knock out the starter early so you could get into the crappy part of their bullpen.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  14. #14
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5GoldGloves:OF,75 View Post
    All at once, yes... but a couple this year, then swap one for a couple more next year, then the next, and before you know it: you win 100 games and finish first without any full-time starting pitchers...

    But that's just one method of bullpen-building. It can help you throw a shutout in the opener of the ALDS, but you also risk getting your doors blown in three straight when an opponent with a stacked line-up exploits a weak reliever or two who just aren't on in each day's endless parade to the mound.
    Agreed, and Bloom has not done all that well finding RP'er gems in the rough, so far.

    He's gone through a lot since 2020 --49 total, including a few everyday players doing mop up duty.

    40 with more than 2 IP in relief 2020-2021:
    Barnes
    Whitlock
    Valdez
    Ottavino
    Taylor
    Sawamura
    DHern
    Andriese
    Brasier
    Brice
    Weber
    Workman
    Richards
    Robles
    Rios
    Springs

    Under 20 IP
    Davis
    Covey
    Perez
    Osich
    Stock
    Walden
    Brewer
    Houck

    Under 10
    Henbree
    Kickham
    Mazza
    Hall
    Feliz
    Gonsalves
    Tapia
    Godley
    Triggs
    Leyer
    Schreiber
    Bazardo
    Brennan
    Peacock
    Espinal
    Hart


    Sox 4 Ever

  15. #15
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    We may get to the point we don't even talk about starting rotations and bullpens any more, just pitching staffs.
    If starters only go 18 batters, maybe they can go back to 4 man rotations.

    Teams can have 8 -4 inning men and 5 short relief guys.
    Sox 4 Ever

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