Have to count Story's $140 mill as a big move, if we're counting Sale's $145 mill as a big move.Originally Posted by notin
Have to count Story's $140 mill as a big move, if we're counting Sale's $145 mill as a big move.
Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1
The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.
He was given the assignment of trading Mookie. Do you think John Henry told Bloom to just offer Bogey a one yr contract ext for $30M? John Henry admitted they bungled the John Lester negotiating, so I think this was all on Bloom. Now I’m not saying JH gave Bloom a blank checkbook, but I think the offer was Bloom’s bungling.
I’m fine with that.
The interesting fallout from that is Story as a big moves also serves as negotiation leverage to prevent Bogaerts from becoming an even bigger move…
???
He was a shitty GM for those years. He also sucked in 2005, 2006, 2009, 2010 and 2011.
Contracts that large probably always are run through ownership. Hard to parse out which person in the FO made which decision.
It’s just a theory of mine, and nothing else. Either way it was a ridiculous offer, and I don’t think it warranted a counter off, which some have suggested on here.
Speaking of Dombrowski ; He just axed Girardi in Philly.
Old school is good school.
Well they signed Harper, and Schwaber the last few years, but didn’t seem to be going anywhere.castellanos too.
Last edited by Old Red; 06-03-2022 at 12:40 PM.
People on here tend to go back and forth about who offered what to who and when, but we never really have the details. None of us really know the inner workings of the FO. When I think of "Bloom" and the GM position, which he's technically the CBO, I just lump the entire front office and ownership group together. I don't think Bloom is running this as a lone wolf. I think he's working with other individuals and getting contracts approved by Henry and others in ownership. It's never really just "one guy."
Henry: Principal Owner/Crypt Keeper
Werner: Chairman/Muppet
Kennedy: President and CEO/Talking Head
Chaim Bloom: Chief Baseball Officer/Fall Guy
Briain O'Halloran: General Manager/Wait if this guy is the GM why aren't people blaming this guy more?
Others of note: Ben Crockett, Eddie Romero, Michael Groopman
Good summary.
Follow your own response about re-signing Sale, something you said you would not have done in response to my saying your accounting might be more creative than the current front office…
Let me rephrase my response.
"Would he current front office have re-signed Sale."
What big moves?
Story is the only one, yet you have already determined Bloom is "in over his head."
Look at the 2020 roster- top to bottom. Yes, it had Betts, Bogey, Devers, Beni and JBJ, along with Nate, Sale and Price.
Look at the roster, now, including the bottom of the 40 man roster and the improved farm quality and quantity. Bloom has not been even close to perfect on his moderate to major moves, but what GM is?
He was handed a 40 man roster with 15-20 holes in it, and a farm with very little recognizable high value players in it.
He was given about $40M to spend before 2021, and the team did very well, considering the budget and starting point.
He was given more to spend, this winter, but only 1 FA contract has ever been signed for more than 2 years. You think that's 100% Bloom's choice? You think he chose to not go over the tax line?
On the Betts trade, how many teams were willing to trade value for a guy making $28M for 1 year of team control? Just the money alone knocked 20+ teams out of even bothering to make a phone call. I'd love to know what other offers were discussed, let alone actually made. My guess is less than 5.
Verdugo looked like a nice get. Of course, equal value for one year of Betts is not going to be someone like Betts with 4-5 years of team control. The idea is that you get something good, and you use the money saved to try and gain equal value, piecemeal. $30M a year for 10 years is a lot of FA value to count on the net ledger. Maybe Verdugo continues to suck, the rest of his time, here. Maybe Downs and Wong give us nothing. The fact is, we lost 1 year of Betts, during a year where he would not have come close to helping us even make the playoffs. Just what value was his 2020 season to us?
I was very upset we lost Betts. Hell, I think I suggested offering more than anyone else, but it looks like he was never going to stay here. I know you've suggested trading these guys earlier to get more return, but then you also seem to get upset when we don't keep them. It's hard to know what you think could have been done in a better way? Bloom could not have traded him "earlier," and unless we know what other offers were out there, just saying "we should have gotten more," or "we should have gotten pitching" is kind of hard to agree with, since it's near total speculation.
Bloom was handed a totally different set of cards to deal with, and a highly restricted budget. It's not his Tampa learnings that has kept him from spending large and long. Before the 2021 season, he still had 7-10 significant holes to fill, that he didn't get filled with an even more restrictive 2020 season budget. He had $40M to spend on all those holes, and because he didn't sign anyone to $25M, some think he's not capable of doing it, or doing it well. Had he spent $30M of the $40M he had on 1 guy, we'd have had the 2020 roster all over again, but with one more good player.
He did what he had to do. He started by building up roster depth to increase the chances a few more players prove they can stick around beyond 2020 and 2021, or be replaced. He basically signed placeholders to carry us to the next winter, in hopes we'd start seeing some help from the farm, and eventually an expanded spending budget, as some deadwood came off the books.
This winter, we will lose some deadwood, but we will also be losing some top talent that will be hard to replace. For some of the guys, re-signing them will not actually give us the same expected results and production we have now. Then, at what cost?
To me, this coming winter is when we will see the real Bloom. We'll all find out, if he's pretty good, just okay or something like "in over his head." This will be the first time he'll have the kind of power and room to wiggle, since becoming the GM.
Yes, DD was handed some deadwood, too, but he was given a farm with many prospects other teams coveted, dearly. He was given a spending budget unprecedented in Sox GM history that spanned for about 3 years. When the cut off his spending, we saw 2019.
I'm hopeful Bloom responds to the challenge and window of opportunity. He'll have some difficult and likely unpopular choices to make. It will be almost impossible to keep every fan happy, and if he does, we'll likely be $50M over the tax line, next year.
Could or should he trade away 75% of our top prospects like DD did, and try and build a juggernaut 3 year window? Some here, seem to think that's the best plan, and count on henry to just spend his way through the aftermath. Not me.
I like the path Henry and Bloom have chosen. It remains to be seen, if they can pull it off. Henry gave up on a similar strategy under Ben. Will he again?
This winter will tell a big story.
When you say it's gonna happen now
When exactly do you mean?
Maybe he didn't like certain fits, maybe he wasn't crazy about what was available at the asking prices, who knows
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