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Thread: 4/16 Cleveland at Boston

  1. #196
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    my support for kenley jansen has always been tepid at best. And the defense thatís heís had a good career was always pointless. I mean, rick burleson had a good career, too. Should we bring him in to play ss?
    yes!
    When you say it's gonna happen now
    When exactly do you mean?

  2. #197
    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    I mean, Rick Burleson had a good career, too. Should we bring him in to play SS?
    Reliable glove, cannon arm, respectable bat (8% K-rate), four times receiving MVP votes, four-time All-Star, known as "Burly" on my vintage 70s Sox painter cap, admitted Yankee hater...

    ... the answer is: yes.

  3. #198
    Deity vegasbob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    Even with 30% of the roster injured, they should DFA Dalbec.

    I never hope a player gets injured, but why is it players like Dalbec never do?
    Nobody ever got a hammie or bad knee strolling from the dugout to the plate and back again.

  4. #199
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vegasbob View Post
    Nobody ever got a hammie or bad knee strolling from the dugout to the plate and back again.
    Some have rolling out of bed or sneezing, though. Not Bobby Dee!
    When you say it's gonna happen now
    When exactly do you mean?

  5. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by vegasbob View Post
    Nobody ever got a hammie or bad knee strolling from the dugout to the plate and back again.
    Sammy Sosa injured himself sneezing. Anyone know if Dalbec has hay fever?

  6. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by notin View Post
    My support for Kenley Jansen has always been tepid at best. And the defense thatís heís had a good career was always pointless. I mean, Rick Burleson had a good career, too. Should we bring him in to play SS?
    Ridiculous comparison. But S.O.P. for you. Jansen may or may not be washed up , but he was an All Star last season . Led the N.L. in saves in '22. Closing ain't easy. Blown saves happen, even to the best. Josh Hader has been getting roughed up plenty this season. On the other hand, even in his 70's, Burleson might be an improvement over the jabronis they have been running out there at short since Bogaerts left.
    Old school is good school.

  7. #202
    Deity Bellhorn04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dgalehouse View Post
    Ridiculous comparison. But S.O.P. for you. Jansen may or may not be washed up , but he was an All Star last season . Led the N.L. in saves in '22. Closing ain't easy. Blown saves happen, even to the best. Josh Hader has been getting roughed up plenty this season. On the other hand, even in his 70's, Burleson might be an improvement over the jabronis they have been running out there at short since Bogaerts left.
    And we do have a lot of jabronis playing in Red Sox uniforms this year, Den.
    Championships since purchase by John Henry group: Red Sox 4 Yankees 1

    The Red Sox are 8-1 in their last 9 postseason games against the Yankees.

  8. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Bellhorn04 View Post
    And we do have a lot of jabronis playing in Red Sox uniforms this year, Den.
    Looks that way. Hopefully, they show some improvement.
    Old school is good school.

  9. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by dgalehouse View Post
    Ridiculous comparison. But S.O.P. for you. Jansen may or may not be washed up , but he was an All Star last season . Led the N.L. in saves in '22. Closing ain't easy. Blown saves happen, even to the best. Josh Hader has been getting roughed up plenty this season. On the other hand, even in his 70's, Burleson might be an improvement over the jabronis they have been running out there at short since Bogaerts left.
    He was. But he was the league-required sole team rep. Really all that means is no one on that team was deemed worthy than he was at their respective positions.

    And he was only worth 1.1 fWAR, seventh on the Sox pitching staff and second among RP. The 1.1 fWAR is also the lowest total of his career nd a far cry from the 3 fWAR seasons he was worth 6-7 years ago.

    But more important, that was last year. This year, he is most definitely not on pace to be another All Star, with an 9:8 K:BB ratio and one 1-2-3 inning under his belt.

    Jansen may one day get in the Hall of Fame, but it will not be for what he has done in Boston. Just like how Dwight Evans belongs in the Hall of Fame, but not for what he did in Baltimore...

  10. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by dgalehouse View Post
    Ridiculous comparison. But S.O.P. for you. Jansen may or may not be washed up , but he was an All Star last season . Led the N.L. in saves in '22. Closing ain't easy. Blown saves happen, even to the best. Josh Hader has been getting roughed up plenty this season. On the other hand, even in his 70's, Burleson might be an improvement over the jabronis they have been running out there at short since Bogaerts left.
    Everything you say in defense of Jansen is true. He has been unbelievably successful--and was as recently as last season.

    However, last night he threw cutters--same speed, same amount of break, but different locations in and out of the strike zone--on almost every pitch. I saw exactly one slider. As a result, the Indians hit him hard, but fortunately two line drives were catchable, as was the final out grounder to 2b. Right now his WHIP is 1.80, which ain't so hot, and it's because in 6.2 innings he has given up 4 hits and 8 walks.

    So, good for you that you believe he's still great, still wonderful, but he scares the daylights out of me. Last night Cleveland absolutely pounded him because he was throwing very hittable stuff.

  11. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxbialystock View Post
    Everything you say in defense of Jansen is true. He has been unbelievably successful--and was as recently as last season.

    However, last night he threw cutters--same speed, same amount of break, but different locations in and out of the strike zone--on almost every pitch. I saw exactly one slider. As a result, the Indians hit him hard, but fortunately two line drives were catchable, as was the final out grounder to 2b. Right now his WHIP is 1.80, which ain't so hot, and it's because in 6.2 innings he has given up 4 hits and 8 walks.

    So, good for you that you believe he's still great, still wonderful, but he scares the daylights out of me. Last night Cleveland absolutely pounded him because he was throwing very hittable stuff.
    Everybody has their bad days. And I don't think he is still great. Like the proverbial old, gray mare, he ain't what he used to be. But he still has a pretty good percentage of success. Hang in there , Max.
    Old school is good school.

  12. #207
    Deity moonslav59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxbialystock View Post
    Everything you say in defense of Jansen is true. He has been unbelievably successful--and was as recently as last season.

    However, last night he threw cutters--same speed, same amount of break, but different locations in and out of the strike zone--on almost every pitch. I saw exactly one slider. As a result, the Indians hit him hard, but fortunately two line drives were catchable, as was the final out grounder to 2b. Right now his WHIP is 1.80, which ain't so hot, and it's because in 6.2 innings he has given up 4 hits and 8 walks.

    So, good for you that you believe he's still great, still wonderful, but he scares the daylights out of me. Last night Cleveland absolutely pounded him because he was throwing very hittable stuff.
    It was bound to happen. He last longer than most. He had a very long run at greatness or near greatness.

    Who knows, maybe he can regain some magic before retiring. He did miss some ST'ing, so maybe he is still trying to find the "lost groove." Maybe it can never be brought back.

    A subjective breakdown of his years:

    First 284 games (6 seasons)
    2.25 ERA/ 2.00 FIP (0.966 WHIP) 4.5 K/BB

    Middle 324 games (5 seasons)
    2.44 ERA/2.50 FIP (0.852 WHIP) 7.7 K/BB

    Last 219 games (4+ seasons)
    3.02 ERA/3.29 FIP (1.131 WHIP) 2.9 K/BB

    That last era was a step down from the previous ones, but it is still damn good. It is also heavily weighed down by his numbers with the Sox:
    3.51 ERA/3.78 FIP (1.344 WHIP) 2.4 K/BB

    Those numbers with BOS were greatly weighed down from the end of July to now.

    July 29 to end of 2023 (14 games):
    6.10 ERA/6.06 FIP

    2024 (7 games
    2.70 ERA/4.60 FIP (9Ks, 8 BB, 1 HBP) Only 4 hits

    July 29 to now (17 IP):
    4.76 ERA
    5.76 FIP
    -0.2 fWAR
    (Only jacques has worse numbers than this, since last July)

    Note: 17 IP is a small sample size, so we cannot know for sure, that this is the new Jansen.


    When you say it's gonna happen now
    When exactly do you mean?

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