Official College Basketball Thread

[See Red]

Thats the huge misconception about him. He's not a 1 dimensional player like McNamera. He scores every way possible, plays good defense, and is the leader of this team. Adam Morrison has put up some big numbers but name 1 other player on Gonzaga. JJ could score 60 if there wasn't anyone on the team to pass to. Morrison is a good player but the lack of talent around him makes him waaaaaaay overrated. It's easy to be a super star with no one else on your team.

Without the talent around him, J.J. would also face the defensive pressure that Adam Morrison probably faces. Haven't you learned from Duke busts past? Guys like Trajan Langdon?

[MC Hammer]

Without the talent around him, J.J. would also face the defensive pressure that Adam Morrison probably faces. Haven't you learned from Duke busts past? Guys like Trajan Langdon?

? Trajan Langdon was one of the better players in Duke history ... how is he a bust? How can JJ possibly be a bust when he'll finish in the top 10 scoring all time at Duke?

Also JJ already faces double teams, and the teams best defender every single night ... so maybe try another argument.

[Manny Goes Boom]

Without the talent around him, J.J. would also face the defensive pressure that Adam Morrison probably faces. Haven't you learned from Duke busts past? Guys like Trajan Langdon?

Or guys who shined in Duke history...a la Jason Williams, Daniel Ewing, Mike Dunleavy, Elton Brand, Corey Maggette and more. Morrison's a great player, but so is JJ. End of story.

[See Red]

I'm saying what have they done outside of Duke's system? How many Duke 'superstars' have gone on to be successful in the NBA? That's where Trajan Langdon comes in. 3 years in the league, averaging about 5 points. Hell, even Jay Williams was a mediocre NBA player.

And no, Redick doesn't face the type of pressure you say he does because of Sheldon Williams downlow. Adam Morrison doesn't have the type of guy that few people in the country and guard 1 on 1 downlow.

[Manny Goes Boom]

I'm saying what have they done outside of Duke's system? How many Duke 'superstars' have gone on to be successful in the NBA? That's where Trajan Langdon comes in. 3 years in the league, averaging about 5 points. Hell, even Jay Williams was a mediocre NBA player.

And no, Redick doesn't face the type of pressure you say he does because of Sheldon Williams downlow. Adam Morrison doesn't have the type of guy that few people in the country and guard 1 on 1 downlow.

Elton Brand is a superstar in my book, only reason he doesn't get any props is because of where he plays. Pretty much the same with Corey. Mike Dunleavy is having a very nice year this year and can only get better. Jason Williams would be absolutely DESTROYING the NBA right now if he didn't get in that wreck. But your thinking past the college level and if you wanna go there thats fine.

Anyway your right though...JJ has Shelden but he still gets it done, and that just says how dangerous Duke really is.

[See Red]

That's how you judge how great a player really is -- how they do against the best of the best. Look at how many McDonalds All-Americans have gone through Duke in recent years. Now... how many turned into great NBA players? 1 or 2? The rest may have the occassional decent year, but even Jay Williams was mediocre as a rookie, even for a rookie's standards. I don't think we can assume that he'd be tearing apart the league -- because i don't think he would.

I still don't think Duke is the best team in the country. Duke hasn't looked good to me, so far. Not like the #1 team anyway -- and I find more negatives in that win over VT than positives. Give me the team that, without their starting PG, won a tournament, the Maui Invitational, that consisted of teams like Michigan State, Arizona, Kansas, Maryland, and Gonzaga.

[Manny Goes Boom]

That's how you judge how great a player really is -- how they do against the best of the best. Look at how many McDonalds All-Americans have gone through Duke in recent years. Now... how many turned into great NBA players? 1 or 2? The rest may have the occassional decent year, but even Jay Williams was mediocre as a rookie, even for a rookie's standards. I don't think we can assume that he'd be tearing apart the league -- because i don't think he would.

I still don't think Duke is the best team in the country. Duke hasn't looked good to me, so far. Not like the #1 team anyway -- and I find more negatives in that win over VT than positives. Give me the team that, without their starting PG, won a tournament, the Maui Invitational, that consisted of teams like Michigan State, Arizona, Kansas, Maryland, and Gonzaga.

LMAO of course you would want your OWN team. OK, that field is lets say "OVERRATED" (As the Houston fans said as they were routing Arizona 20-4 in the first half of the game they WON!) Michigan State ALWAYS starts highly ranked then loses to shit teams (Hawaii) and the loses pile up (Gonzaga, a very good team but w/e). Kansas...umm who? Maryland always plays Duke hard I'll give them that. And Gonzaga is good but UConn SHOULD have won that tourney. Duke has injuries, and JJ was in foul trouble in the VT game. Yeah blowing a team out by 60 isn't looking good.

[MC Hammer]

That's how you judge how great a player really is -- how they do against the best of the best. Look at how many McDonalds All-Americans have gone through Duke in recent years. Now... how many turned into great NBA players? 1 or 2? The rest may have the occassional decent year, but even Jay Williams was mediocre as a rookie, even for a rookie's standards. I don't think we can assume that he'd be tearing apart the league -- because i don't think he would.

I still don't think Duke is the best team in the country. Duke hasn't looked good to me, so far. Not like the #1 team anyway -- and I find more negatives in that win over VT than positives. Give me the team that, without their starting PG, won a tournament, the Maui Invitational, that consisted of teams like Michigan State, Arizona, Kansas, Maryland, and Gonzaga.

No you judge a player against his current competition. Who cares how good JJ will be in the NBA? Right now he's the best player in college.

Grant Hill - STAR
Correy Magette - STAR
Elton Brand - STAR
Carlos Boozer - STAR
Mike Dunleavy - Contributer
Chris Duhon - Contributer
Luol Deng - Contributer

Just off the top of my head thats pretty good for just recent players. How many player from your college team are stars or even contributers to NBA teams?

[See Red]

No you judge a player against his current competition. Who cares how good JJ will be in the NBA? Right now he's the best player in college.

Grant Hill - STAR
Correy Magette - STAR
Elton Brand - STAR
Carlos Boozer - STAR
Mike Dunleavy - Contributer
Chris Duhon - Contributer
Luol Deng - Contributer

Just off the top of my head thats pretty good for just recent players. How many player from your college team are stars or even contributers to NBA teams?

Ray Allen, Rip Hamilton, Emeka Okafor, Ben Gordon, Donyell Marshall, Caron Butler, Charlie Villanueva. The top 4 are stars, and the top 2 are elite players in the League. Yet, my school doesn't have 8 or 9 McDonald's All-Americans at any point in time.

Dunleavy was a #3 pick... you don't look for a contributor at #3... feel free to label him as a bust.

For every Grant Hill, there's been multiple Christian Laettners. For every Elton Brand there's been a Trajan Langdon.

I'm saying judge 'em in the pros when they don't have 7 more All-Americans on their team than anybody else. You say he's the greatest, I say without the talent on Duke, he doesn't get half the looks he gets.

[See Red]

LMAO of course you would want your OWN team. OK, that field is lets say "OVERRATED" (As the Houston fans said as they were routing Arizona 20-4 in the first half of the game they WON!) Michigan State ALWAYS starts highly ranked then loses to shit teams (Hawaii) and the loses pile up (Gonzaga, a very good team but w/e). Kansas...umm who? Maryland always plays Duke hard I'll give them that. And Gonzaga is good but UConn SHOULD have won that tourney. Duke has injuries, and JJ was in foul trouble in the VT game. Yeah blowing a team out by 60 isn't looking good.

I'd take my own team not because they're my own team. I've only picked my team to legitimately compete for the NCAA Championship in 1999 and 2004. Hell, I'd take Villanova and Texas over Duke too -- because like your excuse practically said, J.J. (Or Sheldon, for that matter) get in foul trouble and Duke is done in the tournament. And yes, a tournament which is referred to as one of the best fields ever (NCAA Tournaments obviously excluded) is very overrated. A tournament with 5 top 25 teams, and 4 preseason top 10 teams is very overrated. Basically, your tournament is pretty damn good when you can say that one of the weakest links is Kansas.

Which of Duke's wins should impress me? Seton Hall? Seton Hall's been taken to the wire by Marist and Farleigh Dickinson. In other words, they no good. That doesn't seem much different than UConn killing Texas Southern by 64, I'm not going to preorder my 2005-06 NCAA Champions shirt because of it.

You say that UConn should've won that tournament as a way to dismiss their accomplishment, then your response to Duke being overrated is that they're undefeated. Duke SHOULD win those games -- so by your logic, they don't matter.

[MC Hammer]

Ray Allen, Rip Hamilton, Emeka Okafor, Ben Gordon, Donyell Marshall, Caron Butler, Charlie Villanueva. The top 4 are stars, and the top 2 are elite players in the League. Yet, my school doesn't have 8 or 9 McDonald's All-Americans at any point in time.

Dunleavy was a #3 pick... you don't look for a contributor at #3... feel free to label him as a bust.

For every Grant Hill, there's been multiple Christian Laettners. For every Elton Brand there's been a Trajan Langdon.

I'm saying judge 'em in the pros when they don't have 7 more All-Americans on their team than anybody else. You say he's the greatest, I say without the talent on Duke, he doesn't get half the looks he gets.

Again like I said WHO CARES WHAT DUKE PLAYERS DO IN THE NBA? Maybe UConn fans see things differently, but I root for Duke. I don't root for individuals, and I dont really care what they do in the NBA. Furthermore, how can you judge someone based on where he was drafted? Did he draft himself? Did Dunleavy say ... I'm a 3rd pick! No ... he got drafted where he got drafted ... he had no choice.

You can keep saying that the NBA is the only way to gauge how good a player is and I'll keep telling you it doesn't make sense. JJ is the best player in COLLEGE BASKETBALL. Not basketball period. COLLEGE BASKETBALL. This has absolutly nothing to do with the NBA in any way.

[See Red]

Again like I said WHO CARES WHAT DUKE PLAYERS DO IN THE NBA? Maybe UConn fans see things differently, but I root for Duke. I don't root for individuals, and I dont really care what they do in the NBA. Furthermore, how can you judge someone based on where he was drafted? Did he draft himself? Did Dunleavy say ... I'm a 3rd pick! No ... he got drafted where he got drafted ... he had no choice.

You can keep saying that the NBA is the only way to gauge how good a player is and I'll keep telling you it doesn't make sense. JJ is the best player in COLLEGE BASKETBALL. Not basketball period. COLLEGE BASKETBALL. This has absolutly nothing to do with the NBA in any way.

I don't understand why it's so difficult for you to understand what I'm saying. Like almost every other Duke 'star' -- all of which were thought to be among the best players in the country -- they're a product of the system. They're nothing without the system. You want to argue that Morrison wouldn't be as good with the talent that Reddick has around him -- why can't I basically say the same thing about Reddick in that he wouldn't be as good without as much talent around him and without Coach K's system like most Duke players past?

That's the argument. It's alright for you to say that Morrison is good because of the situation he's in, but I can't argue the same about Reddick?

[MC Hammer]

I don't understand why it's so difficult for you to understand what I'm saying. Like almost every other Duke 'star' -- all of which were thought to be among the best players in the country -- they're a product of the system. They're nothing without the system. You want to argue that Morrison wouldn't be as good with the talent that Reddick has around him -- why can't I basically say the same thing about Reddick in that he wouldn't be as good without as much talent around him and without Coach K's system like most Duke players past?

That's the argument. It's alright for you to say that Morrison is good because of the situation he's in, but I can't argue the same about Reddick?

You can, but your not talking about the situation Reddick is in. You're talking about the situation Reddick will be in next year. If you want to talk about how he wouldn't be as successfull at a different college go ahead, but talking about how he'll be a "bust" in the NBA is in no way the same.

[See Red]

You can, but your not talking about the situation Reddick is in. You're talking about the situation Reddick will be in next year. If you want to talk about how he wouldn't be as successfull at a different college go ahead, but talking about how he'll be a "bust" in the NBA is in no way the same.

No, the reason I bring past Duke players and what they've done in the NBA into this is to prove my very point that "they're a product of the system. They're nothing (bad word to use, though) without the system." At some point you have to look at all the guys that were phenomenal at Duke, that amounted to very little outside of the system and assume that they weren't as talented as they were made out to be because that's more likely to be the case than that they just forgot how to play. I see J.J. Reddick as being no different.

[MC Hammer]

No, the reason I bring past Duke players and what they've done in the NBA into this is to prove my very point that "they're a product of the system. They're nothing (bad word to use, though) without the system." At some point you have to look at all the guys that were phenomenal at Duke, that amounted to very little outside of the system and assume that they weren't as talented as they were made out to be because that's more likely to be the case than that they just forgot how to play. I see J.J. Reddick as being no different.

Well, look at all the guys who have been stars in college and not in the NBA. It's not like Duke is the only college that has stars who don't make it in the NBA. Not all of the McDonalds All Americans go to Duke. The success rate from NCAA to NBA is very low so to just point out Duke doesn't make sense. There are atleast a dozen of college stars moving on to the NBA every year and how many of them actually work out? Exactly. A lot of people like to point at Duke and say "well they haven't had much success in the NBA" but the fact is no college has a great success rate.

You're just a typical Duke hater trying to find anyway you can to put Duke, and it's players, down.

You can talk shit when UConn dominates college basketball for a decade.